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Cortes de Castilla la Vieja; Toledo
Topic Started: Feb 28 2014, 10:59 AM (839 Views)
ileonu
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Extranjero! Muestra respeto en presencia de su Majestad el Rey de Castilla. Plantea tus peticiones y veremos si eres digno de respuesta...

Any petition or declaration about the Kingdom of Castile can be made below.

Our relations are "Extremely Friendly" with everyone until we DOW them. In case that anyone DOW us relations with him/them will go to "Friendly".
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eric292

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Well Portugal has a bone to pick with you Castile.

Your absence on Saturday has essentially nullified our previous treaties.

Castile has a strong prescience in Brazil, something we agreed wouldn't happen.

I am hoping we can salvage the situation, since you were not there for legit reasons, but a commitment is a commitment.

Once Gren opens the new world map you'll be able to see what was done...

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ileonu
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Although we regret what a crazy King may have done, before issuing any statement we need to check the current situation directly on terrain... a worldmap won't give us the full idea of what happened.
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eric292

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Could you expand on what you mean by needing to get a grip on what is going on with the terrain?

The World Map is going to paint a pretty clear picture. And I can say that Castile has colonized a large swath of Brazil, the coastal provinces have already formed "Castilian Brazil"

Portugal understands that this happened because of your absence.

~~~~~~

Assuming what I state is complete fact (which it is) - What options does the Spanish King see in rectifying the situation?

Portugal is open to many suggestions, and is not well versed in dealing with the transferring of provinces.

One suggestion the King allows me to offer is simple payment for the land Spain took. This payment could also open the door to further Castilian expansion into South America.

I just feel it is not completely fair for me to demand you to leave, when you're now ingrained in that territory. But subsidies or massive gold should be a penalty or simple payment for the land that we agreed was Portugal's.

Also, do you plan on continuing to play?
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ileonu
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Well this is the first time i hear about a Castilian Brazil so not knowing what is Colony, City or Colonial Nation (impossible to see in the world map) is hard to evaluate the current situation...

Anyway i guess that any further discussion should be done in private...

You can find my Steam id as one of Gren's friends (Nachopz)
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eric292

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Gotcha, I'll add you to Steam
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ileonu
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Before going to bed i would like you guys to know what i was doing by annexing the Aztecs...

If you have 4 cored provinces and then you core/improve a colony just after annexing the Aztecs the colonial nation will get everything already cored...

BUT my mistake... was that one of the 4 already cored provs was in another Colonial region... so the Colonial nation didnt appeared...=(

STUPID ME... in some sort i ruined a little the game and for that im sorry...=(

But thats the only thing im sorry for =)

Hearing Gren as he had like +40 gold and the hearing him mad because he didnt get even more gold is funny... this is what this game is about..=)

Cheers!

Edit: Intense session... im all shacky... cant go to bed...XD

I hope that i can save Spain from this wreck..... we will see next week...
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Dragonknight2

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Gibe me western buddy
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GrenadierSchube

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UK needs more gold and more land!

North America is now under our control
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ileonu
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Ok so.... (i used Quotes to point some out of context ideas)

I want to clarify what happened...

It all started with Gren declaring on Marquis and Eric joining in. Since day one it was clear to me that France had no chance of winning or getting a white peace.

On several times Marquis asked for military access and tried to convince me, with me saying no. Portugal was my ally, but also even if i knew that in the long term England was the enemy to beat (because our colonial conflicts) i couldn't afford to make him my enemy right away.

And so the war went on getting to the point where neither Gren could enforce peace nor Marquis could do much to harm Gren. And then Gren said that he wanted to GMenforce peace against France because Marquis didn't want to accept Gren's conditions.

Quote:
 
Gren, you are the GM and leader of this group. And in my opinion yo do a great job, until you pull stuff like this. You as GM and leader must be extra careful on what you do and how you behave.


GMenforcing peace?? And i said WHAT? That was totally unfair...

And then i decided that the war needed to end so i finally gave MA to France, after 4 or 5 times he asked, so he could take on Portugal. Ending the war in a white peace.

At any point i fought occupied or was at war with Portugal.

After that came my plan to take on the Aztec (stupid me for not double checking the colonial mapmode). With Gren asking me to split the Aztec and me accepting that or at least looking like...

Gren... on the next game i will send my whole plan before the game so you can plan in advance on how to block me. I couldn't tell you "No you can't have nothing from the Aztec because i'm annexing them"... :P

Quote:
 
About the Aztec i'm not sure if there should be a rule against what i was trying to do because it's pretty strong..


After that Gren was really pissed off. And i was pretty screwed by not executing my plan the right way.Getting rebels everywhere. So he took the chance, asked Luke for help and kicked my ass... Not much to complain there... Altho i feel Luke helped more for his friendship with Gren than from Otto's real interest (sorry if im wrong but it felt that way).

If i could have done my plan the right way i could had a chance and in that case France could have helped, but Marquis couldn't do much with the mess i made of Spain.

But at that point people started to call me a liar, yelling me to peace out and well, it didn't felt good at all...

I'm not asking for apologizes, i just want to set the precedent that this is a game but being angry ingame doesn't give you the right to trash people.

Portugal i'm sorry if you felt backstabbed but you putted yourself in a position we try to avoid as it is unfair. Permanent unbreakable alliances between players can't be right because it ends in situations where you need to act against the best interest of your own country.

Finally i'm really mad with myself because i blew the chance of making this a very interesting game... i hope i can fix it... i'm temped to ask you Gren to check Spain and evaluate if it can be saved. Losing Spain would leave GB to really rule the waves with no match... making the rest of the game pretty boring in that part of the world...
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eric292

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(All Sunday I told myself I wouldn't post, I was/am too vulgar, I won't post....its when I say mean dumb stuff (see my own thread edits)

(Monday morning....Posting....)

~~~~~~~~~~~~

ileonu,

I am sorry I was much too vulgar speaking with you.

To be clear, I knew that French occupation really wasn't going to change much, I was not rage mad at the game.

I was ONLY rage mad at you for betraying trust. And is where I fundamentally disagree with you.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

You 100% did this to yourself Spain, and I hope the flames your country is in will serve as a justified lesson.

We spoke on Steam about being allies. You told me how Gren has to be your rival in the late game. I always told you that I understand that. That I am a minor. Only that when that fight happened I would not intervene or plot in either side!

There is nothing wrong with being trust worthy and not back stabbing. Historically speaking Portugal ALWAYS had good ties with England.

(Spain) YOU ~ Asked me to plot against England, my first and most trusted ally (see treaty of windsor on wikipedia)
(England) GREN ~ Never even brought up or asked me at all to plot against my Iberian brothers.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Let us focus on when France began pressuring you.

Let's see Spain, think about it. You and I have relationship outside of game. We've talked several times.

We had France CRIPPLED economically. He couldn't make any money outside taxation, his army slider was reported to be at lowest level and loans were flowing in.

So someone who never even talks to you, someone who is on their national death-bed, asks you four times for MA and you grant it?

Why do you think he was pressuring you so bad?

Don't you think that if you had come to us with that pressure, YOUR FRIENDS AND ALLIES...we would have helped?

You could be thriving right now....but instead, for reasons I simply cannot fathom, you chose to betray your own cultural brothers because France was whining in your ear.

Seems odd man....

And the game justifiably punished you for it.
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eric292

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By the way,

Your post I thought was very well written. And I appreciate your apology to me and while I vehemently disagree with your actions, your writing allows me to understand you at least some what.

I again apologize for the cursing, I should have just stopped after the second time of privately calling you an effing idiot and I should have stopped after the first public denouncing.

Luckily the outpouring of rage by me only makes me look bad in the end.

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Lukesea

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Actually me and Morocco attacked you because we wanted parts of Italy
i didn't even know gren was coming along too until Morocco told me, so no i didn't help gren because im his friend. Infact me and gren usually have a rivalry in most of our MP games, my sole intention for attacking you was for the italian stuff that me and morocco want.
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eric292

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I can second that, Morocco and I acted as the proxy for diplomacy between England and The Ottomans.

Morocco approached me when I was still allied, but un trusting of Spain.

I sent word gleefully to England, I was of course dismayed when I was told the Muslims only wanted Italy but was (personally) happy to see any aggression.
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GrenadierSchube

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Regarding GM-enforced peace, in our vic 2 games we encourage after a certain period of time that if a nation can not recover, the war would end.

we did not end up doing it anyway so I don't know why that was even brought up…Marquis is right if he had the intention of trying to recover it, he could stay at war as long as he wanted.

Personally I had already planned on attacking you the minute I saw that 15 ducat funding to your rebels was working in my favor, then morrocco came to me asking if i wanted to come with. Of course I accepted.

You did this to yourself :) we had a deal I thought and turned on it. Don't worry I will continue funding rebels to you as well, especially after I destroyed half your army and now that you are out of Manpower.
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ileonu
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The only thing i did to myself was that stupid mistake... without it i could had a chance... with the help of France and that huge Mexico... but well...

Fund those rebels... you won't have much fund after the rest of Mexico breaks out...;)

Also this staurday i would be travelling to Peru, ill bring my laptop and hope to have decent internet...

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eric292

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No and I want to make it perfectly clear Spain. You did this all to yourself LITERALLY because of the MA you gave to France.

Had you not given the MA to France:

**Portugal would have helped broker and soothe relations with England on the Aztec annexation. You already claimed it was a mistake and we could have found an agreement to sell provinces back and keep the peace.

**Portugal would have stood stoically behind you against Muslim aggression. Helping broker a deal between these two super powers.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

If I were Spain, and a broken economy France asked me to betray my BROTHER.

I would tell him to stick it where the sun doesn't shine, and prepare to hold the mountains bordering the country.

You talk about "the late game" ~ its year 1540 or something...its still early -> mid-game.

Anyway, cheers mate! Safe travels, hope you can find Internet.
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shampoocat
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eric292,Mar 24 2014
06:13 PM

If I were Spain, and a broken economy France asked me to betray my BROTHER.

I would tell him to stick it where the sun doesn't shine, and prepare to hold the mountains bordering the country.

Fairly sure Burgundy would have helped, oh no wait Spain abandoned that alliance...
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GrenadierSchube

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ileonu,Mar 24 2014
09:05 AM
The only thing i did to myself was that stupid mistake... without it i could had a chance... with the help of France and that huge Mexico... but well...

Fund those rebels... you won't have much fund after the rest of Mexico breaks out...;)

Also this staurday i would be travelling to Peru, ill bring my laptop and hope to have decent internet...

With the help of France….

he did not even answer the call to arms :) what help from France?

Your navy….non existent. You still had Barques in it….

Your army….won the first engagement, then got decimated in the 2nd one when I upgraded to lv 12 even with your morale bonus. If I remember you lost 2/3rds of your forces left with only 8k and no manpower to battle the 20k stacks of rebels in your lands.

Of course you stood a chance…considering I only sent half of my army to your mainland, the other 20k was in mexico claiming land with my colonies army of 20k
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ileonu
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I dont agree at all....

Understand that if i did the annexation of Aztec in the right way even will all the rebel funding in the world i wouldnt had any rebellion... because it would be New Spain fully cored...

I accept i didn't saw the Muslim aggression but because i thought it was ilogic... that will throw me and maybe France on the side of the Poles...

Also you need to understand that i cant let France die... France will be my long term ally.. i need him strong...

If you want to call for my word i can tell you i never attacked you neither occupied any of your provinces... that was my promise and i kept it.

From my playing experience we are already in mid game about to enter on late... these games never reach the 18th century...

Again ive no problem on taking the heat on this war and from what comes next... but dont tell me i made a mistake trying to deceive you about trying to take Mexico... if you were in my position you would have done the same... or we can ask Tornado if you are one of those that always keep to what he says...;) (Edit That was for Gren)

Also don't forget this annexation thing of the Aztec, IMO is way too strong and gives Portugal a huge advantage...
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ileonu
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GrenadierSchube,Mar 24 2014
09:22 AM
ileonu,Mar 24 2014
09:05 AM
The only thing i did to myself was that stupid mistake... without it i could had a chance... with the help of France and that huge Mexico... but well...

Fund those rebels... you won't have much fund after the rest of Mexico breaks out...;)

Also this staurday i would be travelling to Peru, ill bring my laptop and hope to have decent internet...

With the help of France….

he did not even answer the call to arms :) what help from France?

Your navy….non existent. You still had Barques in it….

Your army….won the first engagement, then got decimated in the 2nd one when I upgraded to lv 12 even with your morale bonus. If I remember you lost 2/3rds of your forces left with only 8k and no manpower to battle the 20k stacks of rebels in your lands.

Of course you stood a chance…considering I only sent half of my army to your mainland, the other 20k was in mexico claiming land with my colonies army of 20k

Again... he didnt answer mainly because Spain was a wreck... but just for that mistake... doing it the right way i would have no OE at all... no rebels... and a nation that (i think) would be stronger than Newfoundland to fight him + the 40k troops i had in Mexico...

Consider that since you started funding rebels with the OE i had, i had to fight them all the time... thats why i was a mess....
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ileonu
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shampoocat,Mar 24 2014
09:18 AM
eric292,Mar 24 2014
06:13 PM

If I were Spain, and a broken economy France asked me to betray my BROTHER.

I would tell him to stick it where the sun doesn't shine, and prepare to hold the mountains bordering the country.

Fairly sure Burgundy would have helped, oh no wait Spain abandoned that alliance...

I ended our alliance because of my Diplo cap... i had no intention of fighting you. I still think that this game is all about trying to not letting the rest win...;)

Edit: Also you were at war with the Poles... not much you could do...hehe

Edit2: Also i knew you were safe against France, on a defensive 1v1 you would always have Austria to back you up...
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Naveed

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GrenadierSchube,Mar 24 2014
08:46 AM
Regarding GM-enforced peace, in our vic 2 games we encourage after a certain period of time that if a nation can not recover, the war would end.

we did not end up doing it anyway so I don't know why that was even brought up…Marquis is right if he had the intention of trying to recover it, he could stay at war as long as he wanted.

Let the record show, you brought it up and tried to carry it forward. Despite a complete and undeniable conflict of interest.
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GrenadierSchube

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Naveed,Mar 24 2014
09:55 AM
GrenadierSchube,Mar 24 2014
08:46 AM
Regarding GM-enforced peace, in our vic 2 games we encourage after a certain period of time that if a nation can not recover, the war would end.

we did not end up doing it anyway so I don't know why that was even brought up…Marquis is right if he had the intention of trying to recover it, he could stay at war as long as he wanted.

Let the record show, you brought it up and tried to carry it forward. Despite a complete and undeniable conflict of interest.

With regards to your hopes of everything going to your colony….

I am almost positive that you need 5 cored pieces of land for it to form a colonial nation.

and when you conquer new lands, what would stop the aztecs from rebeling in your colony that recieved the land?

all in all in my expierence you NEVER annex the aztecs in one go. Everyone that has done it ends up with 150k stacks of indians pissed off

And for the Record. iN THE END it was decided against it. this is why we have 2 co-gms and both agreed he could continue to war as long as he wants. which i then abided by.
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ileonu
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GrenadierSchube,Mar 24 2014
09:57 AM
Naveed,Mar 24 2014
09:55 AM
GrenadierSchube,Mar 24 2014
08:46 AM
Regarding GM-enforced peace, in our vic 2 games we encourage after a certain period of time that if a nation can not recover, the war would end.

we did not end up doing it anyway so I don't know why that was even brought up…Marquis is right if he had the intention of trying to recover it, he could stay at war as long as he wanted.

Let the record show, you brought it up and tried to carry it forward. Despite a complete and undeniable conflict of interest.

With regards to your hopes of everything going to your colony….

I am almost positive that you need 5 cored pieces of land for it to form a colonial nation.

and when you conquer new lands, what would stop the aztecs from rebeling in your colony that recieved the land?

all in all in my expierence you NEVER annex the aztecs in one go. Everyone that has done it ends up with 150k stacks of indians pissed off

And for the Record. iN THE END it was decided against it. this is why we have 2 co-gms and both agreed he could continue to war as long as he wants. which i then abided by.

You should try... its totally doable...

You get 4 colonies into cities and before completing the 5th you stop funding your colonies... then you annex Aztec... then go back funding your colonies... my problem was that the 1st city was in another colonial region.

In 4 or 5 months you will have a fully cored and huge CN....

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Lukesea

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You and france want to ally poland? well i was backing away from sweden and poland... guess its time to reinforce my alliances with sweden and burgundy after all
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ileonu
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Lukesea,Mar 24 2014
11:45 AM
You and france want to ally poland? well i was backing away from sweden and poland... guess its time to reinforce my alliances with sweden and burgundy after all

Not really... it was an idea i had but it seems it has no chance on working...=/
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Naveed

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ileonu,Mar 24 2014
11:55 AM
Lukesea,Mar 24 2014
11:45 AM
You and france want to ally poland? well i was backing away from sweden and poland... guess its time to reinforce my alliances with sweden and burgundy after all

Not really... it was an idea i had but it seems it has no chance on working...=/

Convert to Islam and ally Mughals Morocco and Ottomans
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ileonu
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ما شاء الله
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TornadoWatch
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Kind of a pity Spain died so quickly after forming.. Well, Spain.

I'm not sure how you recover when so many rebels are plundering the countryside.
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