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Topic Started: Oct 25 2011, 05:12 PM (68,340 Views)
Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
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I think the product, at least from an in ring, and to a minor extent creative department, held up until right after Mania X. Then it died until... I don't know, late '97?
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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
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Attitude Era stuff is pretty bad on a rewatch. I would say 2000 for the product being truly good again.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
[ *  *  * ]
I think 1998 holds up until SummerSlam, but 1999 is definitely a dumpster fire that doesn't need to be remembered. When everything was done week to week, written on a cocktail napkin, and making little to no sense, why bother?
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Infinite Devil Machine
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A Very Cunning Linguist
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Scrooge McSuck,Oct 4 2014
02:47 AM
I think 1998 holds up until SummerSlam, but 1999 is definitely a dumpster fire that doesn't need to be remembered. When everything was done week to week, written on a cocktail napkin, and making little to no sense, why bother?

I've started watching WCW's 1999 pay-per-views and they hold up reasonably well, surprisingly. Sure, the main events suck and the NWO is prolific on every event, but WCW actually let their undercard guys and midcard guys tear shit up. Uncensored 1999 featured an incredibly underrated match between Billy Kidman and Mikey Whipwreck. And I'll be damned, but Curt Hennig and Barry Wendham were an underrated veteran heel team and they've been tearing it up on these 1999 shows so far with Chris Benoit and Dean Malenko. And shit, sure they didn't push him to the main event or anything, but Chris Jericho and Saturn had an awesome three month long feud in '99 where they busted their ass in a really solid dog collar match on pay-per-view. And Scott Steiner. Damn, here I thought Steiner, upon hitting his "Big Poppa Pump" phase lost all his talent in one fell swoop. Turns out, he had some good matches with Diamond Dallas Page and had some shockingly good chemistry with Booker T.

So yeah, in case you couldn't tell, I'm pleasantly surprised by how entertaining WCW in early to mid-99 (I'm three matches into Spring Stampede, by the way) actually was.
What "World of Warcraft" players see when they're not playing.....

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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
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Those WCW PPVs fall off a cliff at around Great American Bash.

I don't think 1998 was as bad as 1999 that's for sure. But the undercard was really a mess all year. Austin and Rock's stuff was all good. X-Pac was a top 5 North American worker that year easily.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
[ *  *  * ]
I'm trying to wrap my mind around something... it's nothing new that someone doing random midcard jobs would go on to win meaningful titles (when they were meaningful). It's happened for years, but honestly... why? Bret Hart won the WWF Title on October 12th, 1992. It had to have been known for at least a week or so.

That same night on Prime Time Wrestling, they featured Bret Hart doing a lame pinfall job... TO BLAKE BEVERLY (not clean, but still by pinfall), and only had the match decision reversed by new figurehead Sgt. Slaughter. Yes, this match was taped more than a month earlier, but who in their right mind shows their new Champion looking like a chump against a JTTS tag team? HOW DOES THIS MAKE PEOPLE GO "WOW, HE'S GOING TO DRAW MONEY"!?! Might as well have had Warrior laying down to Haku before WrestleMania 6, or Hogan jobbing to a Wild Samoan the night he made his WWE return.
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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
[ *  *  * ]
Primetime was so low on the totem pole of WWF programming at the time I bet no one even thought that far into it. I think it also shows the utter mess that the product was by the time the fall had come around.

From everything I've ever read that title change was really out of left field. Business was just crashing and they were seeing if they could fix things by shaking it up. It might just be the fact that it was such a short term decision to give him the belt.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
[ *  *  * ]
From what I could gather through old issues of WON, it was a fairly desperate move because of Flair's inner-ear injury. Regardless of the urgency of the situation, there's absolutely no sense in taping a match for broadcast where you're making a top level (it's 1992, we have to stretch the term) babyface do a cheap pinfall job to a bottom tier tag team worker. Ever.

Like you mentioned, the whole company was such a mess, so I'm sure little thought even went into the thinking of what was being taped for TV. They were losing syndication, Primetime was reaching record low numbers, Fox didn't want to carry any more episodes of SNME/Primetime Specials, PPV numbers were down to their lowest numbers to date, house numbers were way down, lawsuits out the ass... nothing was going right.
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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
[ *  *  * ]
How involved was Vince at this point too? This was at the height of steroid gate right? When Vince isn't involved those kinds of oversights tend to happen.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
[ *  *  * ]
Vince was tied up in litigation over the steroids and multiple lawsuits over sexual abuse that ranged from accusations against himself (the female referee from the mid 80's accusing him of rape) and all the stuff against Pat Patterson, Terry Garvin, and Mel Phillips. It seemed like every week, someone else was trying to sue him.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
[ *  *  * ]
Non-lawsuit related troubles from September-October: The Undertaker was injured and missing a lot of dates, Flair had his inner-ear injury and missing dates, Bulldog was let go over what I guess ended up being a bust for HGH, Warrior was being Warrior and no-showed dates and quit/was fired two weeks before a PPV he was heavily advertised for, Hawk walked out on his contract, leaving Animal high and dry until an injury took him out of wrestling for a year or two, and Boss Man was in need of time off for injuries.


Then in December, Nailz tries to beat the shit out of Vince and sues Vince alleging sexual assault.

Guy was having a rough time.
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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
[ *  *  * ]
Michaels was also stinking up the joint on a weekly basis.

They also had the Marty Jannetty shit go down in January but I think that kind of helped Michaels and Jannetty as they were kind of falling on their face leading up to that.

That Raw where Jannetty came back was insane though.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
[ *  *  * ]
Jannetty vs. Michaels at Mania IX is one of those "fantasy" bookings that most definitely should've and would've happened had Jannetty not been a complete fuck up. I liked Tatanka enough, but Jannetty/Michaels felt more like a match that deserved a Mania Spotlight. Tatanka/Michaels felt like "challenger of the week."
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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
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I was surprised by the level of build they gave Michaels/Tatanka on my Raw watching earlier this year. I always felt the same way and they had me excited for the match with the build to it.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
[ *  *  * ]
I always found it odd that Tatanka goes over clean twice, then on PPV wins by a cheap finish... and then we're supposed to accept he no longer is in contention for the title, and a few weeks later starts a a pretty lame angle with Bam Bam centered around Luna and Sherri.
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