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Topic Started: Oct 25 2011, 05:12 PM (68,291 Views)
Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
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I think in a vacuum they were fine. They weren't winning any important matches and guys like Kamala were actually kind of fresh in WCW at the time. I think where 1995 was so shitty is the rest of the card was just fucked up.

The interesting thing about Nitro is it had a really quick positive impact on the product. The Savage/Flair feud at the end of 1995 was actually drawing for them and turning the house show business around. The nWo started a couple of months later but the company had positive momentum going into that storyline.
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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
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This is what I consider to be the good years for WCW:

1985
1986
1989
1992
1996
1997
1998 - just barely.
2001
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
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I'd say 1992 was pretty good until Watts took over and pissed everyone off. Havoc and Starrcade were awful, Ron Simmons gets the World Title for the fuck of it, and Erik gets featured a lot in a spot that he clearly isn't ready for.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
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Based on in-ring ability, Alex Wright was probably the best "green" wrestler ever pushed on WCW TV. Unfortunately, they gave him that stupid fucking dancing/boy toy gimmick that instantly makes men hate him.
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torturedsoulv1
true maharajah Jinder Mahal
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Mad Dog,May 7 2017
04:41 AM
Prime, Pro and Main Event all got culled around the same time frame.

Main Event in the 80s and early 90s was on Sunday nights. For awhile they used it to put on weekly feature level bouts. It eventually ended up as a clip show with a couple of matches in there.

I think either prime or pro was a clip show as well with a couple of matches.

Prime would end with dusty Rhodes announcing the feature match as the prime cut of the week. And then mooing

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torturedsoulv1
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Scrooge McSuck,May 7 2017
06:46 AM
An example of what I was talking about, courtesy Dave Meltzer's WON...


Quote:
 
*The Butcher (Ed "Brutus Beefcake" Leslie) was turned back babyface and will feud with Kevin Sullivan and use the ring name, "The Man With No Name." This was handled clumsily to the live viewers at Disney. On 2/4, in a match against Marcus Bagwell & The Patriot, Butcher accidentally caused Sullivan to get pinned and after the match during an interview, Sullivan piledrove Butcher. Later that day they taped a grudge match where The Man With No Name defeated Sullivan via DQ when he had the sleeper hold on and Avalanche interfered to save Sullivan. However, the next day, in a match taped for cable airing to start the feud that will air before the two matches taped the previous day, with Avalanche & Butcher against Hogan and Randy Savage, he was back as Butcher and as a heel, and in that match after the heels lose, they began teasing a split-up of the Faces of Fear. There was a decent amount of internal opposition to making such a quick turn back, which was largely done so when Hogan hangs out with Leslie outside the ring as they do and are frequently spotted doing so now with wrestling fans, it won't seem like a kayfabe violation. The Man With No Name gimmick is believed to have been suggested by Kevin Sullivan, since he is probably one of the few people who had heard the idea from Paul Heyman about one year ago when Heyman had come up with using that name first for Bill DeMott, and when that fell through, for the character that instead was named 911.



Watching the TV shows, it seems like Butcher is ready to turn, then they drop it all together, then they do the turn, but another show doesn't recognize it happened yet and shows more footage of them as a team without any trouble, and then he's suddenly the Man with No Name. Not that anyone gives a shit about the feud, but it's this stuff that makes keeping up with everything a pain in the arse.

I remember them feuding a short while and then all of a sudden he was in the dungeon of doom as Zodiak

And yes I remember the man with no name part. I don't remember the out of order stuff
I knew they taped months in advance at times and people would come out with belts they hadn't won yet on TV so yeah they did it for a few years

But reading the Meltzer stuff my head hurts
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torturedsoulv1
true maharajah Jinder Mahal
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Mad Dog,May 7 2017
05:38 PM
This is what I consider to be the good years for WCW:

1985
1986
1989
1992
1996
1997
1998 - just barely.
2001


It was still the NwA/jCP in '85 and '86
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Mad Dog
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Oh yeah totally. But I think 85-86 are key years to watch to kind of understand why they keep going back to the Horsemen concept in the 90s.
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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
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torturedsoulv1,May 7 2017
11:51 PM
Mad Dog,May 7 2017
04:41 AM
Prime, Pro and Main Event all got culled around the same time frame.

Main Event in the 80s and early 90s was on Sunday nights. For awhile they used it to put on weekly feature level bouts. It eventually ended up as a clip show with a couple of matches in there.

I think either prime or pro was a clip show as well with a couple of matches.

Prime would end with dusty Rhodes announcing the feature match as the prime cut of the week. And then mooing

Pro ended up on TBS it's last couple of years and was like a C show version of Worldwide. The biggest difference is you sometimes got a solid mid-card match on Worldwide and you didn't get that on Pro.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
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97 Worldwide is strengthened by how awesome of a roster of midcarders were at the disposal of WCW. Compare that to WWF, where you barely had anything outside the top guys. "Oh, Shotgun has yet ANOTHER DOA vs. Boricuas match. Sign me the fuck up!"
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Mad Dog
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ho ho who the hell are you?
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I'm going to make a very controversial statement here...

Steve McMichael was a better Horseman than Dean Malenko.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
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Far, far more memorable, at least. I don't remember a thing about Malenko as a Horsemen, and even though he's a far superior worker, McMichael had the personality that went with the stable. He was loud, obnoxious, full of himself, and was an elite performer... at another sport, of course.
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Erick Von Erich
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I'm Big E and I tell it like it is
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I would watch PRIME with Dusty Rhodes and Chris Cruise, occasionally, in 1996-1997. In my market, I think it was on FSN or maybe even "Prime Sports (PSN)" if it was was still around. It had some of the guys you wouldn't see on Nitro every week; like Bunkhouse Buck or the Yeti. I remember Dusty saying: "a year ago, Bunkhouse Buck wouldn't have been in a match like this".

It was either on PPV or on Saturday Night, where Dusty was lamenting about the possibility of new nWo members and said something like: "we've got all these reporters at WCW. Send out the Mean Gene, send out the Chris Cruise!" Only time I could recall Dusty acknowledging the C-show.Thought that was some fun continuity.


I LOVE Dean Malenko and he sort of spearheaded the reformation of the Horsemen in the fall of 1998; even though it was seemingly overnight, after his feud with Jericho ended at Road Wild. Suddenly, Malenko started asking for a cage match against Curt Hennig-- the guy who tore apart the Horsemen a year earlier.

But I also liked Mongo as a Horseman and think he gets an unfair label as being worthless. When Mongo won the US Title in 1997, it seemed natural. Hey, at least the Horsemen turn got Mongo off commentary. A little surprised that he didn't do any "special" appearances as a commentator after the turn.

Horsemen were disbanded in late 1997, but you knew they'd come back soon. In the spring of 1998, there were rumors of them reforming with Flair, Luger, Benoit, Arn as manager/spokesman...and then GOLDBERG as the fourth member. Or else Mongo, instead of Luger (which is what I had preferred, since solo Lex was doing okay, at the time). I've never seen any confirmation or denial of that rumor, though. Flair had the ugly dispute with Bischoff and all Horsemen talk was killed until the fall and Flair's return.


Oh, and had to re-re-read that Meltzer quote about "The Man With No Name" to figure out what he was trying to communicate. I'm always amazed that Metlzer consistently wrote/writes so poorly. You'd think in all the years of doing it, he would've gained SOME semblance of professionalism or "journalism" and be able to write a normal sentence.
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Scrooge McSuck
I'll get you next time, toilet!
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Proofreading for Meltzer has always, and still is, a problem. It's not as common for him these days, but there's usually one or two obvious flubs that make you scratch your head, usually in the headline article. I hate when he doesn't break up the Raw and SD recaps. I can't read a 3,000 word paragraph and not want to slam my head against the wall trying not to lose my place.
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Erick Von Erich
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I'm Big E and I tell it like it is
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I'll also say that 1998 WCW was better than we remember. Jay Leno and "nWo Late Night" were terrible, but Karl Malone was one of their better "celebrity" inclusions. Especially when they matched him up against Dennis Rodman as a carryover from the 1998 NBA Finals, which had Malone's Jazz against Rodman's Bulls.

Malenko/Jericho in 1998 was great. Even WWE Network admits that Malenko as Ciclope was an amazing surprise. More importanly, the feud really let Jericho cut loose and come into his own as the smart-ass heel he's excelled at, throughout his career.

Booker T vs. Benoit was an excellent program, IMO.

The "mystery" around Bret Hart's association (not membership) with the nWo was pretty good, too. He was never a full-fledged member and the expectation was they were doing a slow burn, until Hart could get at Hogan.

I even liked Sting's program with the Giant, over the tag titles. As much as the nWo Wolfpac gets shit on, they were over as the "cool part of the nWo". Sounds strange, but people had been pining for a Kevin Nash babyface turn, back then. They had some shuffling, early on, but when they settled on Sting, Nash, Luger and Konnan, it was okay.

You'd say: "waitaminut, what's STING doing joining them?!" So you'd always have to remind yourself that it was because his buddy Luger was there, and that the Wolfpac was bascially the "anti-nWo". But they, it got Stinger back out there, hollering and talking.
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