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| Real world map? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 10 2013, 10:42 AM (9,952 Views) | |
| Globu | Jun 10 2013, 10:42 AM Post #1 |
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I'm sort of surprised that no one has ever done an artistic actual-world map. I've looked and not found one -- did I miss it, or is it just something that's never been done? |
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| chelubey | Jun 10 2013, 10:49 AM Post #2 |
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Does it make a sense? Such a map would be very disbalanced and not suitable for any real game. |
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| Deathjester | Jun 10 2013, 11:37 AM Post #3 |
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I made some plans a year ago to make a world map with all the nations placed in their cultural/mythological places on earth, ie Mictlan in aztec/inka territory, Bogarus in Russia and so on. This also made me realize that there are no indian/native american nations - which made me start work on one of those. I still do some work on it from time to time! |
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Check out my mods: The Empire of the Fallen based on Steven Erikson's books (Dom4): Malazan Empire Amazon Tribes United - Feminye, The War Cult (Dom 4): LA Feminye High Elves based on the Warhammer HE (Dom 4): High Elves | |
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| Sombre | Jun 10 2013, 11:39 AM Post #4 |
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I think I've seen a few. Zepath made a european world map called Europa (or something along those lines) and it did indeed have the balance problems one might expect from big deserts and tracts of ice/forest. But there's absolutely no reason a world map would need to be unbalanced. You could quite easily make one that looks like the real thing, makes interesting use of terrain to evoke the real thing and was still balanced. You just need to set pop values and spread out provinces sensibly. |
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I mod for free and fun. But if you want to tip me for work I've done, you can do so through PayPal to rabbitoflegend@gmail.com General Mods: No PopType Recruitment (NI), No Mercs Mod Nations: Warhammer Empire, Warhammer Lizardmen, Warhammer Skaven, Warhammer Chaos Dwarfs, Warhammer Ogre Kingdoms Maps: Warhammer World Older mods not yet ported: AI Recruitment, Ulm Reborn, Black Ulm, Jomon Broken, Avernum, Tharoon, Arga Dis, Daikaiju, Epic Magic Fail, Dromeda | |
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| Edi | Jun 10 2013, 11:54 AM Post #5 |
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There was a real world map for Dominions 2 and I think there may have been one buried someplace in the early Dom3 period. They never did get a whole lot of traction though and making a new better one would not be very difficult. You can probably find the world map for Dom2 on Shrapnel. |
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| Admiral_Aorta | Jun 10 2013, 12:06 PM Post #6 |
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Suddenly a troll appeared in the laboratory!
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I have one kicking around in that's not the whole world, just eurasia. It's not very artsy though, since it seems to have been based on a satellite photo and there's not really any attempt at balance. |
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| Elmokki | Jun 10 2013, 02:06 PM Post #7 |
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I once started drawing a non-projection very rough world map with proportions that would be somewhat balanced at least for some nation setups. It would've worked fine at least if like 50% of the land would've been Europe. |
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| Globu | Jun 10 2013, 06:56 PM Post #8 |
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Hmm... well, I don't know if it'll go anywhere, but I grabbed a full-on detail map from naturalearth.com and NASA's G.Projector software, and am messing around with using tutorials from the Cartographer's Guild to turn it into an artistic map something like the Saderan-style map, which is just eye-poppingly gorgeous and apparently quite doable:![]() And probably either using this sort of projection (interrupted Goode-Homolosine) or the old standard ovalish one (Winkel Tripel) --- that G.Projector software can take any map and put it in pretty much any map projection you want, and is small and free on top of that: ![]() Yeah, it's not perfect, but I don't like the plain rectilinear maps where everything in the higher longitudes is all squishy and distorted and Iceland is bigger than Australia, or in the Mercator maps where Iceland has grown as big as South America and Antarctica looks like a third of the globe. Anyway, partly the inspiration is having boys who like Dom3, but who keep on doing shit like pointing to India when I ask where China is, and to Turkey when I ask where Egypt is (after spending an hour talking to them about the geography of Egypt). You have to remember, I'm sitting here in America, where we're famous for not knowing shit about the geography of the world until the media tell us our government is sending troops there. Thinking about how well I learn the layout of a fantasy map from playing on it, it could be really cool to learn the layout of the actual world from it. But that's all beside the point. Anyway, it'd also have to be appealing and balanced and all that. That Cartographer's Guild stuff is seriously nice. So, tall order, but worth a look methinks. |
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| RodriguesSting | Jun 10 2013, 07:09 PM Post #9 |
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Antarctica ISN'T a third of the Globe? Now you are going to tell me that the North Pole actually exists and isn't just a glorified sea... Now, seriously... there is a lot of problems when you try to render an realistic representation of Earth in Dominions, because even if the maps allow you to "go around it", it's still a 2d map, and wouldn't properly represent the fact that earth is spherical, and not an 4th dimensional cylinder. I suggest to create an "fantasy Earth" for this purpose, with approximately the same continents and land distribution, but maybe with slightly different shapes. Doing so, people will not complain about the fact that isn't 100 realistic. |
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| Globu | Jun 10 2013, 07:22 PM Post #10 |
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Hmm. |
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| RodriguesSting | Jun 10 2013, 07:25 PM Post #11 |
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WHAT HERESY IS THIS?! DON'T YOU DARE TO TELL ME YOU ARE ONE FROM THAT GALILEO'S HEATHENS THAT BELIEVE THE SUN IS THE CENTER OF THE UNIVERSE!! (typing too much in capitals makes me fell bad )
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| Globu | Jun 10 2013, 07:42 PM Post #12 |
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You would not believe the number of different projection types there are. Galileo would just hang it all up. I personally think at least half of them are just dudes trying to get their name on something by making up some weird-ass projection that makes the earth unrecognizable, or a projection with a slight, insubstantial difference. It's just unbelievable. ![]() I mean, seriously? (Actually, that one is pretty legitimate, even if weird. But what about this: ![]() With all maps, you basically have a tradeoff between (1) directional accuracy, (2) geographical accuracy (degree of distortion of landmassses), and (3) aesthetic. Mercator maps, for example, have perfect directional accuracy (longitude lines are straight) at the cost of massive distortion (and also aesthetic stupidity) in the higher longitudes. You can spend hours researching and then come up with the same conclusion as National Geographic and the general geographical community did (for general use), or you can just grab their conclusions and run with them to begin with: either a gored/lobed Goode-Homolosine map projection or a Winkel Tripel projection or any one of the score of projections *almost* just like it. Gores/lobes (those interruptions, or cuts, at the top and bottom) are annoying but allow the closest approximation of both correct direction and landmass size, at the expense of damaging the aesthetic with the interruptions. But hey, most maps only give you one of those three things. If you're in the mood to see the bizarre variety of them, check out how many different projections there are here. |
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| RodriguesSting | Jun 10 2013, 07:48 PM Post #13 |
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Most of these happened for "political and economical reasons", which is an euphemism for "bribing or threatening the cartographer, or maybe both". A map where Europe is bigger than the entire America(s)? The guy was bribed by England. The South America is bigger than the northern? The guy was bribed by the Portuguese or maybe Spanish crown. In the end, it was a game of "who had the biggest" (ha-ah! Dick jokes!), because nothing show (showed?) supremacy as having (or pretending to have) a huge landmass under your control. And taking a look at Stalin, maybe they were partially right. Now, everything you said is perfectly right, in geographical therms. And the most accurate map is also the most cumbersome and practically useless one: the damned globe. Edit: Waterman's was specially creative on this one, heh? A damned butterfly? I am surprised that not a single company tried (yet) to make am projection in the form of it's logo. Managing to smuggle this to the schools would be the biggest marketing win in humankind history. |
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| Globu | Jun 10 2013, 07:52 PM Post #14 |
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Nah, that's actually a different matter. For the gross size inaccuracy, I never got the impression that was political so much as it was poor methodology. As for where you center the map, that's a completely different question. Right now it's rather about how you project it in order to get the most accuracy, no matter where you center it, and that's not at all a simple matter. As for actual centering, the general consensus seems pretty inescapable: you need to center on Eur-Africa if you want to avoid splitting up major continents. The only other option is centering on the pacific ocean, which is less amenable to criticisms of Eurocentrism, but is ridiculous in that it puts ALL the major continents on the periphery. |
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| Globu | Jun 10 2013, 07:55 PM Post #15 |
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Just imagine the poor children if Waterman's map got into the schools. "Which way is north, little Billy?" "NO! Not in that part of the map!" SLAP SLAP SLAP. EDIT: Ah, that's right, just found the Dom2 world maps you were talking about, Edi. I now remember seeing them a long time ago... and passing them up. One of them is pretty nice as far as it goes, actually. The other, yeah, pretty rough. |
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