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Tips, tricks & random mechanics thread; share
Topic Started: Jul 1 2016, 05:58 PM (2,723 Views)
Itwastuesday
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*Spicy* Crew
As just evidenced by the Earlyeh thread by athros, there's new blood trickling in every once in a while, and I'm sure many of us simply never thought about nor encountered something. This game is pretty obtuse to get into, perhaps it would help if one could just skim over a bunch of working tactics they can use and traps they wouldn't want to fall into.

Starting :

- Asshole throne defenders with titans and whatnot, and just in my damn cap ring! What to do? Disease them. Independent province armies still die to disease. Have a bane venom charm fester there for a while, cast plague or whatever.
- PROVINCE REVOLTED PROVINCE REVOLTED PROVINCE REVOLTED OH GOD WHY I HAVE LUCK 3 ORDER 3 :de Well it doesn't happen on PD11+ provinces. It's expensive, but maybe worth it on some provinces.
- You want to use that beautiful blood magic to defeat old age problems? If you do, make sure you're not wearing your boots of youth at the same time as you cast your getting-younger spell or it won't do anything.
- Frigging Astral Corruption, ruining everything I want to do. Except the spells I can cast with mindless mages such as Golems and mind-vesseled Androdai. Such as that big dispel for... Some other global because blood doesn't take no for an answer.
- Defender's advantage is so big in this game sometimes, as they get to go first. So when your armies are going to meet in a province between them, teleport/cloud trapeze a thug there to take it over in the magic phase so you get to move first and get the advantage.
- So you have your E snake, and he can forge hammers for your shitty nonE nation, but it takes forever, as in a few turns he could be doing other E things for your shitty nonE nation. Well why not just cast Forge of the Ancients for a better effect and less micro? Other than having to research const-7 instead of 2 and the inherent risks of globals.
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Red_Rob
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Whilst I applaud the sentiment of the thread, I am a little mystified by some of the specific examples you chose. Encouraging newbs to spend more on PD seems dangerous, given one of the big differences between players and AI is how effective PD is in repelling them.

For PD specifically I'd start off with something like this:

  • Always put 1PD in each province, otherwise they can be captured by enemy scouts without a fight. It also means you will get to see any enemy army that captures them, giving you vital intel on the enemies force composition and layout.
  • More PD should be used situationally. In general a properly built army or raiding force will deal with up to around 20PD without suffering any losses, making it a very expensive way to slow them down. If your opponent is raiding with very light forces it can be worth going up to 10-11 PD on certain provinces.
  • The messages a scout gives about PD are the same for 1-5PD, 6-19PD and 20+PD. Therefore it can be worth buying up to 6PD on borders to deter light enemy attacks.
  • All PD is not equal. In general any of the tribes are pretty useless and not worth buying up at all, whereas Barbarians or Heavy Cavalry can hold off an enemy thug in sufficient quantity.
  • On forts always put some PD up to defend if noone is patrolling. Fort PD includes your national troops and you get more than normal so it is usually worth going up to 10+
  • PD can also be used for instant-chaff. If you know a province your army is in will be attacked next turn you can buy up PD as a cheap way of providing a screen of troops. As PD costs increase per point there is usually a sweet spot where you are getting more troops than you are paying for. It can even be worth going up to 20+PD in this specific situation if it will help your army win an important battle.
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onard
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Do remember that 10 PD reduces unrest, so if you capture a great province with 150+ gold and some unrest, getting the 10 PD will pay itself fast thanks to better taxes.

Also some key provinces you simply don't want to risk losing to random events and thus you should invest somewhat more solid PD, which I believe was the OP's point. Maybe it's a key supply line, maybe you found a bunch of great sites, either way don't trust the fickle luck dice too much.
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Executor
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Eh, Bane Venoming a cap adjacent province is a dubious call to me. It pretty much means that the province is still indie by turn 20-25 and that you won't take it before at least turn 30-35 in that fashion and once you take it over the province will mostly be dead.

Anyone that invests in raiding parties that can kill 6 PD will make sure they can also kill 15 PD. It's also worth noting that most raiding parties will have little trouble in dealing with any, reasonable, amount of PD. Also, PD is very easy to script against and 15 PD is pretty much a regular indie province strength which is useless most of the time.
Having 5 PD is usually the best choice when it comes to investing in PD since it can defeat the early remote province attacks and a few other lucky attacks, though 1 is still the most common and best choice.

I can also confirm that experienced players almost never spend gold on PD, even as a buffer, and especially against random events.
Crappy troops that you can't script often work to your detriment in important battles. And the worst thing about investing id PD is that you're stuck with it once you buy it. I've had important battles go entirely and horrifyingly wrong simple due to the presence of my own PD. I'm sure there are others too. They'll clog up the battlefield and disrupt your formations and make routing your army all that easier.
It's fine investing in PD when you know an attacking is coming your way and when you have decent poptypes and the game is early enough for those troops to actually be useful.
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sum1won
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I'll add an addendum: I will take 10-15 pd in forest provinces immediately before claiming the throne of gaia.
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Gregstrom
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10-15 PD with a few cheap mages as backup can be a fatal surprise for raiding forces.
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Welzi
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Itwastuesday,Jul 1 2016
07:58 PM

- Frigging Astral Corruption, ruining everything I want to do. Except the spells I can cast with mindless mages such as Golems and mind-vesseled Androdai. Such as that big dispel for... Some other global because blood doesn't take no for an answer.

Hi,
Sorry I must explicitly ask this: Do I understand correctly that you can't dispel a blood global? That would be really unexpected for me...
Thanks for your answers in advance!
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Sombre
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No, it's just that blood slaves are far easier to get in large quantity than gems. So if you dispel a blood global (which may have a huge overcharge of blood slaves put in it and be very hard to dispel) they can pretty easily just put it up again.
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Welzi
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Thanks mate. That makes perfect sense.
Cheers
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GlointheDark
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Executor,Jul 5 2016
07:24 PM
Eh, Bane Venoming a cap adjacent province is a dubious call to me. It pretty much means that the province is still indie by turn 20-25 and that you won't take it before at least turn 30-35 in that fashion and once you take it over the province will mostly be dead.

Anyone that invests in raiding parties that can kill 6 PD will make sure they can also kill 15 PD. It's also worth noting that most raiding parties will have little trouble in dealing with any, reasonable, amount of PD. Also, PD is very easy to script against and 15 PD is pretty much a regular indie province strength which is useless most of the time.
Having 5 PD is usually the best choice when it comes to investing in PD since it can defeat the early remote province attacks and a few other lucky attacks, though 1 is still the most common and best choice.

I can also confirm that experienced players almost never spend gold on PD, even as a buffer, and especially against random events.
Crappy troops that you can't script often work to your detriment in important battles. And the worst thing about investing id PD is that you're stuck with it once you buy it. I've had important battles go entirely and horrifyingly wrong simple due to the presence of my own PD. I'm sure there are others too. They'll clog up the battlefield and disrupt your formations and make routing your army all that easier.
It's fine investing in PD when you know an attacking is coming your way and when you have decent poptypes and the game is early enough for those troops to actually be useful.

Perhaps I don't qualify as good. But I will often use 10 pd to reduce unrest. Especially with a turmoil build, or a blood hunting build.
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Rejakor
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Tip for dealing with Zeus/Gaia/Whatever.

Send a mage with 4 paths, and 2 gems, and 4 individual troop units attached to him and in front of him, to attack them. Script him hold retreat. Script troops whatever. Zeus or whoever will blow scads of gems killing 4 troops. Repeat until they run out of gems. Then kill them with regular tactics. Their armies are much less scary without fog warriors/mass protection/army of lead/whatever.
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TreantHugger
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Rejakor,Jul 6 2016
11:17 PM
Tip for dealing with Zeus/Gaia/Whatever.

Send a mage with 4 paths, and 2 gems, and 4 individual troop units attached to him and in front of him, to attack them. Script him hold retreat. Script troops whatever. Zeus or whoever will blow scads of gems killing 4 troops. Repeat until they run out of gems. Then kill them with regular tactics. Their armies are much less scary without fog warriors/mass protection/army of lead/whatever.

Throne guardians don't run out of gems. It's hardcoded.
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Itwastuesday
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Executor,Jul 5 2016
07:24 PM
Eh, Bane Venoming a cap adjacent province is a dubious call to me. It pretty much means that the province is still indie by turn 20-25 and that you won't take it before at least turn 30-35 in that fashion and once you take it over the province will mostly be dead.

You only need to disease the titan, you can move your bv off then. It doesn't take that long, or it shouldn't. And then you have a bane venom charm to use.
Eagles may soar high, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.
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suppenit
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Spring hawks and guarding P3 throne titans with air magic spamming Air Elementals and Fog Warriors can be dismissed by single thug or SC immune to electricity (Ring of Tamed Lightning, Storm Spool).
aka olli!, bumpjack
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Zonk
Dom 5 Beta Team
Bumping the thread as it seems the most fitting place to mention this:

Gift of Health (applies to all units) and MA Agartha's Golem Cult (applies to units that are mindless & lifeless but not undead) each give +10% max HP per candle, but stack *multiplicatively.*

Meaning 10 candles in Golem Cult + Gift of Health dominion will give some units x4 rather than x3 max HP.
You can have Illearth elementals with 200 max HP that regenerate 30 per turn.

Not claiming this is something to build a serious strategy on, or a good reason to play Agartha pretender + Pangea disciple (for E/B and the ability to cast GoH and possibly blood sacrifice - don't remember if disicples can do that), but I thought it was worth sharing :)

(It's also possible this is a bug - not sure lifeless units should benefit from Gift of Health)
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