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PVW - Heatwave 1.30.12
Topic Started: Jan 30 2012, 04:26 PM (2,395 Views)
Nevermind...
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A Pimp Named Slickback
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On the matter of all the back stage segments: I agree that there were a tad too many this show.

However...

I can understand why. Since this is an entirely voluntary thing, whenever anyone wants to put something in, you'd be really hard pressed to turn it away, or tell them "we already have enough for this show."

Coordinating something like this must be a nightmare. Getting a bunch of flakes like all of us to communicate all their plans before-hand has to be like herding cats. Having spent a summer as a cat herder, I can attest to the fact that it sucks!
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Codered
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Nevermind...,Feb 2 2012
09:45 AM
On the matter of all the back stage segments: I agree that there were a tad too many this show.

However...

I can understand why. Since this is an entirely voluntary thing, whenever anyone wants to put something in, you'd be really hard pressed to turn it away, or tell them "we already have enough for this show."

Coordinating something like this must be a nightmare. Getting a bunch of flakes like all of us to communicate all their plans before-hand has to be like herding cats. Having spent a summer as a cat herder, I can attest to the fact that it sucks!

Bingo...

If you guys haven't noticed I am a little different as a fedhead. This is your guys league ... your guys fun. I don't dictate things. I offer up directions and try to make sense of things.

I try to use everything I can ... and I try to use most ideas if it fits within the landscape of the league.

The last few shows have had a lot of things sent in. It's two fold, I love the participation and the excitement and the hard work. Also a lot of good things have been sent in regardless what the Pickycast said! :)

However, it the last show was a 29 part outline.

We will find a good medium ... stories need oncards and stuff. We do have a big roster ...

We need to move some of them to Shockwave and that means deadlines need to be honored a bit better.
PVW Website: www.pvwrestling.net
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JeremySAtWork
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The story I needed to tell required five segments; the problem was that I was late in starting them. I needed another set of shows basically, because I couldn't start this until Quartermann was established as being a member of the roster, but had to finish it before actually facing Nevermind. Ideally, the two on Shockwave stay where they are, and the three on Heatwave get split amongst the next Shockwave and Heatwave.

But oh well; such is life.
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rcole,Feb 1 2012
08:42 PM
And then, having Johnny Detson suddenly being a face after having been such a heelish “President”-type character? It felt rushed when his story seemed more about that title shot than any catering to the fans. Add Fontana to the mix, though I think his was probably the best of the face turns in that he gave us humanizing elements during the previous cycles. It feels like people are rushing to fill a void with regards to a lack of faces in the upper levels.

Maybe I’m wrong, but there has been a lot of recent criticism in that regard and it’s actually not something I agree with. I happen to think there are plenty of Face characters who could be elevated. I do not believe in the argument that none of them are “at that level”. I think a good run from several of the current faces could be a big angle given the opportunity, especially if they’re considered the underdog.

I'll expand on what Pick said with less swearing and hate.

This go around this cycle and I guess cycles in the future I haven't been writing crowd reactions. I've might have said Detson is defacto meaning I simply couldn't out heel Gibson especially after what happened the cycle before so if the fans were looking to root for someone in a title match I think they would choose Detson over Hayes, maybe not.

One man one goal, extremely selfish although the swagger has been lost based on last cycle. Detson is not a face.

In fact thinking as I'm writing the only face turn has been Fontana. Cole and Craven can never be faces although brutality is something that will always be cheered for. The Biz Kid has yet to be determined.

Maybe this is a bad analogy but pre NWO WCW had heels and faces after the NWO WCW had faces and no heels but people who weren't faces because you couldn't out heel the NWO.

The only legit heel outside of HOPE right now is Black because everybody else would get cheered going against Hayes... just the way it is.

Detson has that match against Weaver and is beloved. Detson has that exact same match against Dos and he's hated.
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E2dB
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Guest,Feb 2 2012
01:07 PM
rcole,Feb 1 2012
08:42 PM
And then, having Johnny Detson suddenly being a face after having been such a heelish “President”-type character? It felt rushed when his story seemed more about that title shot than any catering to the fans. Add Fontana to the mix, though I think his was probably the best of the face turns in that he gave us humanizing elements during the previous cycles. It feels like people are rushing to fill a void with regards to a lack of faces in the upper levels.

Maybe I’m wrong, but there has been a lot of recent criticism in that regard and it’s actually not something I agree with. I happen to think there are plenty of Face characters who could be elevated. I do not believe in the argument that none of them are “at that level”. I think a good run from several of the current faces could be a big angle given the opportunity, especially if they’re considered the underdog.

I'll expand on what Pick said with less swearing and hate.

This go around this cycle and I guess cycles in the future I haven't been writing crowd reactions. I've might have said Detson is defacto meaning I simply couldn't out heel Gibson especially after what happened the cycle before so if the fans were looking to root for someone in a title match I think they would choose Detson over Hayes, maybe not.

One man one goal, extremely selfish although the swagger has been lost based on last cycle. Detson is not a face.

In fact thinking as I'm writing the only face turn has been Fontana. Cole and Craven can never be faces although brutality is something that will always be cheered for. The Biz Kid has yet to be determined.

Maybe this is a bad analogy but pre NWO WCW had heels and faces after the NWO WCW had faces and no heels but people who weren't faces because you couldn't out heel the NWO.

The only legit heel outside of HOPE right now is Black because everybody else would get cheered going against Hayes... just the way it is.

Detson has that match against Weaver and is beloved. Detson has that exact same match against Dos and he's hated.

Oops didn't put in my name.
Parrots > owls
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CobiWann
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Codered,Feb 2 2012
09:50 AM
Nevermind...,Feb 2 2012
09:45 AM
On the matter of all the back stage segments:  I agree that there were a tad too many this show. 

However...

I can understand why.  Since this is an entirely voluntary thing, whenever anyone wants to put something in, you'd be really hard pressed to turn it away, or tell them "we already have enough for this show." 

Coordinating something like this must be a nightmare.  Getting a bunch of flakes like all of us to communicate all their plans before-hand has to be like herding cats.  Having spent a summer as a cat herder, I can attest to the fact that it sucks!

Bingo...

If you guys haven't noticed I am a little different as a fedhead. This is your guys league ... your guys fun. I don't dictate things. I offer up directions and try to make sense of things.

I try to use everything I can ... and I try to use most ideas if it fits within the landscape of the league.

The last few shows have had a lot of things sent in. It's two fold, I love the participation and the excitement and the hard work. Also a lot of good things have been sent in regardless what the Pickycast said! :)

However, it the last show was a 29 part outline.

We will find a good medium ... stories need oncards and stuff. We do have a big roster ...

We need to move some of them to Shockwave and that means deadlines need to be honored a bit better.

What might help is, once people turn in their stuff on the day of the deadline, is going back to some of them and going "this is going on Shockwave/this is going on Heatwave, do you want to change it up at all?"
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Codered
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CobiWann,Feb 2 2012
01:26 PM
Codered,Feb 2 2012
09:50 AM
Nevermind...,Feb 2 2012
09:45 AM
On the matter of all the back stage segments:  I agree that there were a tad too many this show. 

However...

I can understand why.  Since this is an entirely voluntary thing, whenever anyone wants to put something in, you'd be really hard pressed to turn it away, or tell them "we already have enough for this show." 

Coordinating something like this must be a nightmare.  Getting a bunch of flakes like all of us to communicate all their plans before-hand has to be like herding cats.  Having spent a summer as a cat herder, I can attest to the fact that it sucks!

Bingo...

If you guys haven't noticed I am a little different as a fedhead. This is your guys league ... your guys fun. I don't dictate things. I offer up directions and try to make sense of things.

I try to use everything I can ... and I try to use most ideas if it fits within the landscape of the league.

The last few shows have had a lot of things sent in. It's two fold, I love the participation and the excitement and the hard work. Also a lot of good things have been sent in regardless what the Pickycast said! :)

However, it the last show was a 29 part outline.

We will find a good medium ... stories need oncards and stuff. We do have a big roster ...

We need to move some of them to Shockwave and that means deadlines need to be honored a bit better.

What might help is, once people turn in their stuff on the day of the deadline, is going back to some of them and going "this is going on Shockwave/this is going on Heatwave, do you want to change it up at all?"

I agree that would help if half the oncards didnt come in after Shockwave was sent out.
PVW Website: www.pvwrestling.net
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CobiWann
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Codered,Feb 2 2012
01:28 PM
I agree that would help if half the oncards didnt come in after Shockwave was sent out.

There's an easy way to solve that.

Cobi - "Sorry, this oncard is a bit late..."

Bell - :facepalm:

:angry:

:censored:

:boxing:

:chairbash:
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Tracy
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- First thing, we start off with... A PROMO! Here, we have The Biz and he's running down his opponents in the impending four way scramble while raging about his spot in the rankings. Good, solid promo with some nice zings thrown in. At first, I thought it was a tad longish. But as we'll see, this segment was all too brief in comparison to the rest of the card.

- And WE ARE LIVE FROM SINISTER'S DRESSING ROOM! Wait-what!? Yep. We are in Big Daddy Sin's dressing room. Sinister is his usual laconic, monosyllabic self wherein he delivers his plans for HOPE in three words. Oh wait, what am I talking about? Sin is EXTREMELY laborious here, lining his ideas for HOPE out for all to read. Then, here comes Chris Hartt! They talk for a bit about HOPE, and agree to an alliance. This wasn't bad, and I understand the whole storyline thing going on here. But I wonder if we really need to hear Sin's plans going in. Especially looking at it from the point of view of HOPE. I mean, you have to think they watch the show... right? Who's to say they couldn't use this to compromise a Hartt, or a Dos...?

- FINALLY, WE ARE LIVE AT REXALL PLACE IN EDMONTON! And we have our first match of NO! We have Perry Fontana! And he's pissed! Fontana comes out to announce his tag team partner for his upcoming match who is... Derek Weaver? Um.... okaaaaaay. I admit that I love this bit. Fontana does a good solid face-ish promo. And Weaver is always excellent. But then, Fontana hits Dream Weaver with the Amputation, shoves poutine down his throat, says "OUAIS!" a lot, and yeah. Good stuff, but I think the part with Fontana going over on Weaver undercuts the upcoming match.

- Holy Shit! WE HAVE A MATCH! FINALLY!!! Night kicks off with the four way scramble between Biz, Hudson, Gionet, and Manson for the TV Title shot. My problem with these type of matches normally is that one or two opponents will generally tend to fade into the background so the other two guys can have their action bits. But this was a very well done match. Nobody really disappeared for too long, and everyone had a chance to spotlight their stuff (except perhaps Gionet). Hudson seems to be the punching bag here, as he takes a TON of Manson's special moves. Somewhere during all of this action, Biz puts on his mask and becomes THE DRAGON KID! Or does he? The mind boggles. Doesn't matter in the end though, as Hudson eats the Widowmaker heart punch for the pin. Manson takes the win, but then Uncle Frank and Lineage come out to beat him up and make him apologize for the evil evil things Manson's done to Frank and his TV Title. Manson responds with a ginormous headbutt! Well, there goes the title shot... post-match bit, and it makes me wonder if we can welcome Lineage as a HOPE for a better tomorrow.

- And we go to the back, where Livestock and The Gutch are TALKING! Livestock's worried about his partner's condition going into their match with The Berserkers. Meanwhile, Livestock himself has apparently put his sperm in someone's uterus. Congrats? Gutch wants cheesecake and other things that go GREAT with diabeetus, but 'Stock ain't having any of it. Good stuff here. I really like the way Moze writes their interactions. Stock and Gutch come across as natural in their exchanges, and I do get a very real sense of Stock's concern for his partner.

- From there, we go the the HEAT! Arvelle is out to hype his team in the HIT II, and give Hoyle a trophy as an honorary member of the group. This celebration is very short lived as the Nixon-Mao accord come out to lock Arvelle in THE ATOMIC WEDGIE~! Sure picked a bad day to wear a man-thong eh? Not a bad segment, but to be honest, the HEAT still haven't sold me yet.

- If this were any other show, this would be the fourth of fifth match of the night. But here on SegmentWave, Supreme Wright V. Nevermind is only the second match of the night! Sigh... I wrote this match, and I still maintain my original feelings about it. This match was one of the worst pieces I've ever written, and Terry and Alan both deserved a lot better. Wright goes over in a screwjob. Sorry, guys.

- Annnnnnnnnnnd we're BACK IN SIN'S DRESSING ROOM! What the...? Sin's doing Sinny stuff when he gets another knock on the door! This time, it's BIZ! Erm...it's DRAGON KID! So, DK wants to aid Sin in his fight against HOPE. Sin doesn't trust him, but war makes strange bedfellows. So does tequila. Maybe they shoulda tried that? Fuck, maybe I shoulda tried that! They shake hands and stuff. And with that, we are completely, entirely, 100% done with any and all Sinister segments!

- And Masked Moses returns to talk about his plagues and stuff. Who is this masked man? It's a mystery! I am all for letting this mystery remain unsolved, because I just don't care one whit about this angle.

- It's Ric Flair. Everyone knows its Ric.

- No. It's Merc! And he's going up against Heath Dawson! It looks as though this match is going to be the beginning of a longer story between these two. Quite frankly, both deserve to be higher up the rankings if what we've seen between these two is any indication so far. Merc goes over with the Halliburton case to Dawson's noodle.

Now, this has set up a match between the two for Tradition where both men's contracts are on the line (basically, Merc wins, Dawson becomes Fatality Marshall's buttpuppet. Dawson wins, and Merc's contract with Fatality is cut.). In another thread, I said that the best ending for this would be for Merc to throw the match. Let's hope that this is the setup for that to happen.

- And here's Talion! He's with Danny Daniels, complaining about the Presidential Refereeing of Shockwave's Talion/Holiday matchup. Long story short, Talion want another match with Holiday, Daniels wants to go in with Holiday too. Kevin Quartermann and Nevermind are thrown because they were there and needed something to do... I guess? Quartermann is still having issue with the Occupiers, by the way. I actually really liked this part. I thought Daniels and Talion were interesting together. I especially liked the bit where Daniels does the whole "Ta Lion" thing. It does a good job of getting Talion over too. I really REALLY am starting to like Talion. Who is he? I don't care. In fact, I'm strongly in the camp of people who NEVER want Talion to unmask. He's awesome as is.

- We continue backstage, where we see Weaver and Johnstone! Weaver's pissed off and selling the amputation from earlier. I like this. I'm not entirely sure what Johnstone's purpose here was, since he didn't say anything, but it did a solid job of selling both his AND Fontana's matches.

- You know, I'm terribly glad that Max and Sal and Lineage didn't feel the need to take 500 promos to hype their match, which is happening RIGHT NOW! One major strength of PVW right now is their tag team division. Right now, it's small enough so no team gets left out, and big enough to just keep all the matches interesting. There may be a need for another team or two later on. But for right now, this is one area PVW really dominates. This match shows exactly what I mean, as both teams are running VERY strong right now. Max And Sal win, but as Hoyle points out, Lineage has only really just started here... Which is scary, when you think about it!

- And we now return you to your regularly scheduled programming. Here's QUARTER MAN! Today, we feature Quarter Man himself as he once again pits himself against the elusive Occupiers. This time, he makes them think that he set them up as patsies for Uncle Frank. But no! He didn't! It was a joke! Ha-Ha! Good, but unnecessary.

- Speaking of unnecessary, here's SINISTER! AGAIN! This time his special guest is none other than SENOR CLOAK DOS! Oh my God. I totally get that Sin's supposed to be the locker room leader and the face PVW builds around against HOPE. Did we really need three backstage promos to illustrate this point? And if that isn't the case, what are they building up to?

- Well, I don't think they're building up to Livestock. Still, he's up next. He's TALKING! To Masked Maniac! They're talking about Fontana and some dude who got his arms all fucked up by the Amputation, but Heath Dawson shows up before Maniac can segue into diarrhea-boarding. Damn... Dawson tells Stock that Gutch is down. The fatty got his ass kicked by somebody. Who did this? Dunno, but I am HOPEful this angle will come to a satisfying conclusion. Dawson gets blindsided into being Stock's partner for the match against The Berserkers, which is next!

- The reason why the Livestock/Gutch/Dawson series of promos worked because they were able to build up to a quick payoff. And it did the best at telling the rest of the story IN THE RING! There was the Livestock/Gutch promo, this one with Dawson, and then the match. The Berserker's love for Stock/Dawson is like a truck, rolling over Dawson for the win. I got into this match... Maybe because it was an actual match instead of a segment. Or maybe because I like the storyline going on with 'Stock and Gutch. Or maybe it's because I'm liking everything I'm seeing from Dawson so far. It doesn't matter. Great work by all involved.

- Once more, we're BACKSTAGE! Now we get to look in on Perry Fontana as he's seeing to the damage Weaver and Hope put on him earlier when...Look! It's CRAVEN! And he's KRAAAAAAZAY! Fontana tries to recruit Craven for his upcoming match, but Craven's too busy being KRAAAAAAZAY to help. Not bad, but unnecessary. Not to mention it undercuts the element of surprise I think we're supposed to feel when...

- ... WE'RE BACK WITH SINISTER! Wait no! That wasn't what I was gonna say. Fuck. Whatever. Here's more Sinister and Dos. And this time they're confronting SPECTRE! Gist of this is that Sinister and Spectre are going to meet at Tradition in a Rebirth Rules match, with Dos as ref. Did we REALLY need four separate segments on the same show to build this up? With all of that buildup though, they should have had the match here! Damn it all.

- We're back in the ring, where Christopher Black and Erich Sieger are there to pick up their angle from Shockwave. I really dug the hell out of this one. And it's here where I notice to trouble with this card- The stories told IN the ring are really good, but they all sit mired in between segments that really don't go anywhere.

- Meanwhile, QUARTER MAN is back. Don't worry... he's not really going anywhere either. ANYWAY, he's back to debating the Occupiers. This time, he records one of their comments on his cell and plays it for Spectre who is in the hall. Ha! He's KIDDING! That wacky Quarter Man! Lord only knows what wackiness he'll get up to next! Oh, wait... Spectre really WAS out in the hall? And he really comes in to confront some bums! YES! Once again, Quarter Man saves the day!

- Look! Here's Gibson Hayes! Remember him? Anyway, he's here to hype his match . Good stuff. Hayes hits all the notes he needed to and made it all work. Oh, and that match? It's NEXT!

- We have Gibson Hayes and Uncle Frank versus Perry Fontana and- who? Nobody shows up yet. But wait! Match is interrupted by a... by a FUCKING PROMO!? Oh well, at least it's in the ring right? Oh, surprise of surprises! It's WILLIAM MAJOR DAMAGE CRAVEN! But because of the promo prior, you knew that right? So yeah, now it's Fontana and Billy Damage versus Hayes and Frank. And once again, this match was really good. I know what Picky thought of it from his Pickycast, but I still think it was a good match and it ended in just that perfect bitch heel way.

- And bloody hell... We're back to the further adventures of QUARTER MAN! Now he's punching occupiers! And I GOT that Quartermann will be pairing off with Nevermind. I figured that out a couple segments back. Did we really need this one?

- Back to the ring where Brian Young comes out to explain the reasons for his actions against Cole. Basically, Cole messed his shit up real bad and it made Young bitter because while Cole went on to get all the glory and acclaim, Young got to pee and poo in little plastic bags. Cole comes out and says that yes, he deserved everything Young has done to him, but he's glad that Young will be the one to end his career on Tradition, which is when Cole's contract ends. You know what? I thought this promo was very well done. I sympathized quite a bit with Young on this, even though he's supposed to be the heel. Cole is supposed to be the face here, and I see this going one of two ways: Cole loses to Young and rides off into the sunset, which makes this promo part of a bittersweet farewell. Or Cole wins, and this whole thing is part of a larger picture to further entrench Cole as a monster wild card heel. Either way, this segment was great stuff.

- FINALLY THE MAIN EVENT! It's Weaver versus Detson, and neither pull any punches here. Just a good intense matchup from start to finish. I also really dug the way Errol ended the match. Picky on his program said that Detson doesn't care about anything else but getting that belt after being an afterthought for so long. And it shows right here in that finish. See, Detson clearly wants to fight HOPE. But he wants to do it his way, and when he decides. Detson loses by DQ, but it all fits, so I give this a high mark.

- We coulda ended on that note, but NO! Here's Preston "Not Mayfield" Winfield to announce the main event and contract signing between Detson and Hayes. Well... It was what it was. But did we really need this segment to announce these things?

FINAL ANALYSIS- This was still an excellent show, but it was incredibly frustrating at the same time. Good in-ring work got mired in long promos that meandered on throughout the card. Sin and Quartermann's segments were especially problematic because they spend most of this card promoting stuff that won't be happening until Tradition. I understand the need to hype, and I also respect that there are stories here that need to be told. But it shouldn't take this many segments to do so. Also, the segment with Fontana and Craven prior to their match took away a LOT of the mystique surrounding it, since the second we saw Craven on camera, we knew he'd be the guy to help Fontana. Had they cut out that one segment and then had Damage come in as Fontana's partner, the "HOLY SHIT!" factor would have been so much higher. But at least the segment was relevant to a match that actually happened on this card.

For what it's worth though, all of the segments were good. And I know why they were there. I just wish it didn't detract so much from what was actually a good in-ring card.
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Codered
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Awesome review Tracy. I have a lot of thoughts on things you guys have been mentioning and there are some reasoning behind _some_ of it. I'm not sure how much I want to get into it ... or just think about ways to solve some of them going forward yet.

PVW Website: www.pvwrestling.net
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TheotherJC
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On an entirely unrelated note, I vote for Lou Crowe never reffing one of my char's matches again. Very distracting to hear Hoyle yelling at Crowe...
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Overly_Critical_Jue
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All I wanted out of that match was Wright beating up homeless people and you gave me that, Tracy.

That'll do, pig. That'll do.
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rcole
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@E2dB:

I thought that's what Detson was going for at first. It's just that with Hayes selling him like a top face, with him turning down the offer from the lawyer, it looks more like the "Bad Ass Face".... not every face is a Baby, though that seems to be the only recognizable Face to Picky. Some faces have an attitude, some of them dismiss the cheers of the fans (which makes the fans cheer even louder), and some even do outlandish things and still get cheered.

Road Warriors never acted like faces, but they were. There are so many more examples of it... heck, Freddie Blassie became the most over Face in the San Fran territory even though he used weapons, gouged eyes, choked, and used every dirty tactic in the book... because was also a fighter!

People cheer a fighter. They boo someone who takes the easy road, who lies, who blatantly cheats, and someone who treats weaker people badly. They will cheer someone who takes a stand... even if it's generally for selfish reasons, the people still cheer that person. They're a "hero". They don't have to pause for pictures or talk about respect at every turn. You may not see your character as a traditional "Face" but that's what he's turned into.

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Tracy,Feb 2 2012
02:35 PM
- You know, I'm terribly glad that Max and Sal and Lineage didn't feel the need to take 500 promos to hype their match, which is happening RIGHT NOW! One major strength of PVW right now is their tag team division. Right now, it's small enough so no team gets left out, and big enough to just keep all the matches interesting. There may be a need for another team or two later on. But for right now, this is one area PVW really dominates. This match shows exactly what I mean, as both teams are running VERY strong right now. Max And Sal win, but as Hoyle points out, Lineage has only really just started here... Which is scary, when you think about it!


Actually, I cannot really accept that praise since Steinar and I wrote a backstage promo as well which probably got lost in the shuffle.

I will post it later today as it tries to explain how Uncle Frank and Lineage can work together.
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Picky
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Now let us retreat wench, for tonight, we feast on snobbery...
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Tommy, when is Helga Verhoven going to show up?
Have I told you how much I loathe your continued existence today?

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