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Maths Sucks
Topic Started: Apr 23 2007, 10:27 PM (848 Views)
Ade
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Beth-prophet
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streppy
Apr 27 2007, 11:53 PM
as primary teacher in Scotland could potentially teach up to 14 yr olds

No comment :vhappy2:

I remember everyone moaning about doing calculus in our A-level class, as they don't see a point to it for everyday life. Unfortunately, you have to cater for everyone, as when you get to do things like meteorology, you need to use it proficiently.

Of course, you use it for basic things that you don't realise you are doing; kinematics being an obvious example. You accelerate your car (a = v-u/t) , which has to overcome friction (f = \mu / n) and so forth. Imagine a bridge falling down cos the civil engineer didn't have a good grounding in basic forces!

My philosophy when teaching is: stay one step ahead of the brighter kids!

(If they surpass expectations, beat the little feckers senseless!)

Good luck for the rest of the exams, Y. You'll rock them!
Went to the JobCentre today, and the Army were there going "Be the Best" ... now T-Mobile just told me I didn't have the qualifications to sell phones, Microsoft said I didn't have the qualifications to answer the phones, and the Army want to let me loose with a machine gun?
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streppy
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Beth-maniac
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Quote:
 
Of course, you use it for basic things that you don't realise you are doing; kinematics being an obvious example. You accelerate your car (a = v-u/t) , which has to overcome friction (f = \mu / n) and so forth. Imagine a bridge falling down cos the civil engineer didn't have a good grounding in basic forces!



This is my point entirely. People dont have to think of formula they just put thier foot down. Very reminiscent of my OU course last year that had me discussiong boing a kettle to make tea and washing dishes as scientific processess. These Things can still be done without thinking of them in those terms. At most we would not be required to teach beyond basic equations/ graphs even for kids operating at level f (expected to be gained by the age of 14) Most kids are out of Primary by 11 1/2.
Some of the worst wrongs are righted on three chords, unless they are played by Status Quo...
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Ade
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Beth-prophet
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Unfortunately, I can't remember what my teaching as an 11-yr old was like. But what I am saying is, the brighter kids need to be taught the things that are going to push them into a career in Maths. For this, there isn't enough time for them to catch up at a later level, as maths is your "syntatic sugar" for every subject, as they all touch on it in some way. They need to be prepared for it.

Admittedly, their brain has to be prepared for it, which in turn the preparation comes from teaching them things that seem irrelevant at the base level. And obviously, the teacher has to be prepared for it.

For a relatively weird example, surds are used for calculating non-computable numbers, such as those yielded by the Ackerman function. The basic theory is that no-matter how fast computers get, there are some equations that can't be computed.

I'd certainly want to know that the guy who designed my Corsa knows that the strength of the forces pushing against my windscreen doesn't push it through, which would cause a bit of a dent in my face!
Went to the JobCentre today, and the Army were there going "Be the Best" ... now T-Mobile just told me I didn't have the qualifications to sell phones, Microsoft said I didn't have the qualifications to answer the phones, and the Army want to let me loose with a machine gun?
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streppy
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I agree that dispositions towards Maths should be encouraged in Primary, however my point is that the type of Maths required by my course would never be touched on before 3rd year at High School. Ofcourse engineers need to be extremely competent, but my point is that these competencies are developed towards the latter stages of secondary education whereas basic groundings are built in Primary. The job of a primary teacher is to stimulate and develop mathematical interestthrough a wide range of activities. I spoke to three colleagues today who said their blood run cold at the word surd. That's something for teaching staff at the next level to deal with.

The reality is that the percentage of people that go on to professions where safety of the general public based on these Mathematical concepts are so narrow that promoting mathematical interest and enthusiasm at primary level should be enough. Secondary is where the necessary mathematical skills necessary are nurtured and honed .
Some of the worst wrongs are righted on three chords, unless they are played by Status Quo...
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Ade
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I can't argue where and when children should be taught, as I don't know what they are taught, nor are expected to remember.

If I am following the trends in professional computer training though, being a course representative, things that were once taught in 2nd year degree undergrad degrees are now being pushed onto the 1st year courses, and so the basic maths training that is given to a computer scientist has to go somewhere, so it goes to the sixth form (hence matrices making it to the curriculum on the year I left). What do we do with the upper sixth-form? we double up the work on the 5th form, and so on ... until we get there to primary school.

I think up to the point of GCSE, they should be streamed to the people who are gonna need it professionally, such as the engineers, and the people who are gonna need it for a basic level (i.e. calculating VAT on a quote ... amen), which it does at the moment, but to too high a level. Bearings was part of my GCSE course ... save that for the campers, I say!

The argument then is of course, not every child will know what they want to do for a career (my sister has completed a degree, and doesn't know what she wants), and also their teacher might not appreciate their ability, and force them into a lower class.
Went to the JobCentre today, and the Army were there going "Be the Best" ... now T-Mobile just told me I didn't have the qualifications to sell phones, Microsoft said I didn't have the qualifications to answer the phones, and the Army want to let me loose with a machine gun?
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gazc
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it is all a bit of an impossible question... at school no one was interested in doing maths which meant that the school stopped offering the full maths option at a-level. this made it difficult to get on a maths course at uni and still hard to do the maths on an engineering course (which is what i did).

when at primary school our teachers actually pushed us a long way further than was necessary, some of the topics we didn't reach the same level until three years into comprehensive school. this did make one hell of a difference to me as then i found all the maths up to gcse pretty straightforward. also i think it did help me to get on and with a sound grasp of maths pick up computer programming easier.

do i have a point, not sure....um

oh, for the first time in years i am starting to use some of the maths i have learnt again., strangely i think i get some of the uni stuff now that just went over my head back then.
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streppy
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Well, tomorrow is D-Day. I've gone over past papers, some questions make sense, others may as well be written in code (changing the subject of formula certainly is :wtf: - whats the probability of me chucking all numbers and symbols up in the air and hoping they fall in the right order??) Let's just hope I come through it more like an ally and less like a German... :blink:
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rc.cope
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Good luck, Yvonne. If all grades were handed out according to hard work, you would ace that class.
No matter what your final grade is, be comforted in knowing you gave it your best...which is all anyone could do.
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy.
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streppy
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Cheers for that Rob. Well, the deed is done... :sick: :sick: :sick:

If I have passed it's by some miracle scrape. How ironicthat this thread is Tangent - that's what most of the trig questions were on after me practising Cos and Sin, a bit like rain on your wedding day as Alanis would say.... :whistle:
Some of the worst wrongs are righted on three chords, unless they are played by Status Quo...
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rc.cope
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I've got my fingers crossed.
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy.
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Ade
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Beth-prophet
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Missed this!

At least it's over now, Streps! Well done for staying calm.

Gutted you got the tangent questions, but it should at least be the same principle.

Of no help to you now, but if you ever get stuck on the next one, and have time left at the end of the paper, you can actually work out the tangent:

Tan(x) = Sin(x) / Cos(x)

That SOHCAHTOA (sock-a toe-a") mnemonic is very useful

Fingers crossed :peace:
Went to the JobCentre today, and the Army were there going "Be the Best" ... now T-Mobile just told me I didn't have the qualifications to sell phones, Microsoft said I didn't have the qualifications to answer the phones, and the Army want to let me loose with a machine gun?
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streppy
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All will be revealed August 7th. I've just found someone who had roughly worked out the answers from paper 1 and from what I can remember of my answers I think I may have managed 16 out of a possible 30... no news on paper two yet. I may just scrape it as long as the threshold isnt raised. Do you reckoin the fact that I wrtoe "PLEASE!" at the end of the paper will hold any sway??

Still have the third assessment to do tomorrow, so back in amongst it tonight again.Hopefully if I pass assessment tomorrow I can pack everything away until next year. There';s no shame in having to redo it is my current mantra - half the class were doing resits whereas it is 20m years since I have done any Maths and I was shit at it then. At least if I am resistting itI'll be coming to it with some sort of knowledge bank rather than being flung in at the deep end. The gradient of this particular learning curve has been at least 80:1 :unsure: Thanks for the support!
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Ade
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Beth-prophet
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Aren't Uni pass marks 40%?

You'll fly it if you got over 1/2 marks, no problems. The way you were talking, I thought you were gonna get like 5/30!! Fingers crossed!

Quote:
 
I may just scrape it as long as the threshold isnt raised. Do you reckoin the fact that I wrtoe "PLEASE!" at the end of the paper will hold any sway??


Teehee

My housemate had an exam at Christmas time, and drew a Santa Claus on the paper, as you couldn't leave before 35 mins, and he was done in 10 mins. The lecturer gave him a mark and wrote "VERY GOOD" next to it ....


unfortunately, he only got 2 /30
Went to the JobCentre today, and the Army were there going "Be the Best" ... now T-Mobile just told me I didn't have the qualifications to sell phones, Microsoft said I didn't have the qualifications to answer the phones, and the Army want to let me loose with a machine gun?
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rc.cope
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When I was in college, I had a history class. The prof was somewhat of a free thinking hippie ding dong. He said the entire grade was to be based on a paper we wrote on a history book of our choice. Oh, and attendance did not matter.
Well, I wrote my paper on a ficticious book, with a ficticious author and publisher. I got a B+, and never opened a book.
He also let you smoke in his class as well. He smoked too, and did not want to have to leave the class.
Smoke 'em if you got 'em... :2cool:
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy.
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Ade
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Beth-prophet
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We had no cool teachers, aside from my dear physics teacher, Dr. Jones, who nearly poisoned himself showing the ripple effect of mercury when you pass a conductor carrying electric charge through it.

Passes an electric current through the wire, which he has dipped in mercury .. . ripples. Puts his plastic pen in, no ripple. Chews his pen. He almost nearly electrocuted himself showing us a current balance too ... smoke and sparks everywhere!
Went to the JobCentre today, and the Army were there going "Be the Best" ... now T-Mobile just told me I didn't have the qualifications to sell phones, Microsoft said I didn't have the qualifications to answer the phones, and the Army want to let me loose with a machine gun?
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