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It's time.; Taker/HHH HIAC.
Topic Started: Feb 21 2012, 01:46 AM (146 Views)
Miller
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It's been asked every single time, but I think this will be the last time. The pieces are all in place, the board has been set, and it's time to see the man who ruled the WWE for the last twenty years, in the ring as well as backstage, take his final walk down the rampway.

Taker started the Hell in a Cell. He made it a structure to be feared with his wars against Shawn Michaels, Brock Lesnar and Mankind. Triple H has won more HIAC matches than anyone else, [Taker included], against the likes of Batista and Jericho. Taker was chosen to retire Michaels, and will now be retired by Michaels, [and Taker's] close friend. They have warred and battled and gone toe-to-toe multiple times over the years, and each time has been a match worth remembering. Plus, there's been more than just the usual rumors of retirement circulating as late. Now there's talk his. [Taker's], knees are giving out. He's been looking to focus more on his real estate ventures, and life itself is finally catching up to the Deadman.

As devout a fan as I've been... to be honest, I agree with it ending like this. I would have preferred to see Foley, Austin or Kane be the one to break the streak, or maybe even one of the younger stars, but I can nod my head and accept the streak ending at the hands of The Game. At least HHH is someone who won't squander it and turn it into some kind of 'Golden Goose' to flaunt. It'll be handled with all the respect that's due, just how Flair and Michaels did it, and Taker did it with Michaels.

...or am I the only one that's expecting this to be the last time we see the Phenom make that slow walk through the mists?
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Mr. D
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I'm expecting it to be his last match too. But I'm expecting him to be victorious. I only say this because Triple H doesn't need the win and this is a way to really tell a compelling story, while hiding up any limitations by both men, and it's a big way to give Taker 20-0 and then he can ride off to the sunset and get inducted in the Hall of Fame whenever just by mentioning 20-0 and that's that. I just really don't see the streak ending regardless of Taker retiring as it's just too respected and too much built into the lore. Plus, it also opens up possibilities for Taker to continue to compete down the road should he be up to it and they still have a marketable match just by promoting the streak. Either you keep options open or you pay respect to the most loyal employee you have and give him something no one else in the history of the business holds.
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Shawn Winters
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This won't be the end for Taker. They're already marketing next year as Taker's retirement in Texas his home state and all. No way HHH ends the streak and in my mind nobody will. Taker will win and get his "redemption" in a match that I honestly don't care to see. Simply because they've been doing this with Taker for 4 years now. Shawn and Taker I loved....then they simply remodeled it for HHH and Taker. It's the same story basically and it's boring now.

I personally would of prefered Taker vs Jericho but WWE doesn't see Jericho as the high enough star that in reality he truly is.

Next year will be Takers last and he'll have an opponent where we might actually think could end the streak. It won't be Austin because Austin's last match would prolly be vs Punk. I personally could see Taker vs Orton or Taker vs Kane.

But Taker vs HHH won't be the end for Taker and if somehow it is and HHH wins...I'll stop watching WWE forever because I'm sorry HHH doesn't need that credit to his resume. Especially now when he's about to run things.
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Miller
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Good points on both counts.

If he DOES win this match and retire -next- year, that'd definately leave the Taker fan in me high as a kite... but at the same time, I don't want to see this turn into another Flair, or Steamboat or Nash, where you have someone they just keep around for name value, regardless of whether he has the health or ability. (Not that I'm about to even BEGIN to question Taker's ability, lol). I mean hell, the guy is constantly evolving.

I don't know if I want to see the last match go to Orton, though. I love Orton, I always have, and I probably always will, but he's in the same boat as HHH. Randy has already established himself as one of the best in the business. He's come a LONG way from when he botched his own finisher on Christian, :P . After HHH though, he's got to be at least the second-biggest name in the WWE. Kane, to my knowledge, has mentioned his own retirement a time or two as well ...so maybe Olek's right, and he'll simply win this last match, (which will be his 20th victory. The same as the number of years he's wrestled for the WWE), and then disappear. I think I really would like to see it done that way.

20 years. 20 WrestleManias. 20 Souls Laid to Rest.

I could definately live with that!
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Shawn Winters
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Whenever Taker does retire he'll retire undefeated at Mania.

At this point it makes no sense for an HBK or HHH to take it away as it does nothing for them. If Taker lost it'd be to a guy who WWE wants to DESPERATELY get over. At this point...Taker gets the matches he wants and he wins them at Mania because he deserves to go out on a damn good match.

I just dislike that Taker vs HHH has to have a gimmick. Because I feel they can't have a good match alone. Being the HBK fan that I am I take pride in HBK vs Taker twice were actual matches. No chairs or anything, they were actual matches but like Taker said on RAW

"Shawn was better than you"

which everyone knows is true.
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Miller
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Ooph... that's a tough call for me.

Michaels, obviously, is not even to be questioned. His title match against Vader, his war with Triple H, his matches with Razor Ramon, Jericho, hell, damn near anyone. You can brush the dust off any HBK match you want and use it as a 'How-To' tutorial.

But Trips, let's be honest, is arguably one of the best in the business, himself. He can work some phenominal matches with the right people. His feuds with Randy, Shawn, Jericho, Angle, Taker, etc. He's even carried CENA, FOLEY and BATISTA's asses on more than one occasion, which is next to impossible. Steamboat of all people, Ricky 'The Dragon' Steamboat, said that Triple H was one of the few people who still carried the honor and legacy of professional wrestling in this day and age. I know that may not be much of a cite for his in-ring skill, but it still says alot about his talent, his performance and his presentation.

And I'm a fan of both, so this isn't a question of bias for me.
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Shawn Winters
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I agree HHH can go when given the right opponent. Being a fan for as long as I can remember I don't see HHH as a wrestler. Sure in today's standards he'd awesome. Because today's standards are very low.

To me...I look back at guys like Shawn Michaels, Curt Henning, Bret Hart, Randy Savage, Jake Roberts, Ted DiBiase those guys were wrestlers. (Undertaker included as the only big guy who could perform in my mind). HHH isn't in that same mold he's in a mold right under.

I do praise WWE for the Hell in a Cell idea tho...because it's the only way to get people interested in this match. I didn't like there match last year because it just showed Taker's limitations with a guy like HHH. Taker counted on HBK carrying the matches the last 2 years which he did. HHH doesn't have that same capability. So chair shots and weapons were chosen to make up for it.

Now, we're in the same boat. What's next? Hell in a Cell...good job WWE because that's all you could do to make this match for the 3rd time "new".
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Miller
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You left out Rude in that list, Murph. Unless you thought Rick wasn't much of a wrestler. I always thought he had some great in-ring work. He had some great matches with Roberts, especially, over having Cheryl on his tights. (Something Winters should think about trying sometime, lol). And I think Vader, Bam Bam Bigelow and Stan Hansen might take a little offense to Taker being the only 'big man' who could work a good match, heh.

But back on topic, I get what you're saying, and I agree to an extent, but I think that HHH and Taker could have put on a -very- good match, 'cause they've done it before. I think it was WrestleMania 18? ..it was the feud that started right at the start of HHH becoming 'The Game,' when he threw Taker's bike off the stage. They had a great match at WM that year, and it's because their styles blended a lot better than anyone thought,

Trips is a very methodical, technical and strategic wrestler. Very old-school, much like Roberts, Rude, Hart and the others you mentioned. Taker, now that he's fallen back on his boxing, MMA-ish offense and power-game is along the same lines, but with more power involved. I can see them having all kinds of chains, transitions and spot-series that would bring the crowd to their feet a hundred times over.

The fault, in my eyes, lies with WWE and the fact that Vince, or Shane or Lauranitis or whoever it is, seems to have an absolute hard-on for obliterating technical wrestling as a whole. Look what they did to Benoit. Look how they treated Ultimo Dragon, Dean Malenko and even Jericho for awhile. Hell, they only -JUST- started giving Bryan Danielson some actual on-screen presence. I don't know what the issue WWE has with technical wrestling, but even if they dropped the HIAC, and just made it Triple H v. The Undertaker, I have no doubts it still would have brought the house down long before the final three-count, because both men are simply that damned good.
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Lucas Knight
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I don't personally see Taker losing at all, they'll tease it a lot but I think he'll end it 20-0.
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Madelyne
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20-0 seems like the best way to end it, but personally, I hope against hope that they'll go for one more 'Mania... simply because I'll be trying my damndest to get to next year's WM in person. They gave another chance to see The Rock (since both he and Cena teased a match next year), and I hope I get to see 'Taker as well. That said, if the guy's knees really are giving out, then it's best to end it at 20-0. Triple H can call the shots on a lot of matches by throwing his political weight around, but there is no way he could do that with 'Taker. The only way he loses this match is if he agrees to it, and I just don't see him doing that with this particular opponent. If he were facing a new kid who needed a serious push, 'Taker would put him over. But not Triple H.
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Mr. D
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Miller,Feb 21 2012
03:36 AM
The fault, in my eyes, lies with WWE and the fact that Vince, or Shane or Lauranitis or whoever it is, seems to have an absolute hard-on for obliterating technical wrestling as a whole. Look what they did to Benoit. Look how they treated Ultimo Dragon, Dean Malenko and even Jericho for awhile. Hell, they only -JUST- started giving Bryan Danielson some actual on-screen presence. I don't know what the issue WWE has with technical wrestling, but even if they dropped the HIAC, and just made it Triple H v. The Undertaker, I have no doubts it still would have brought the house down long before the final three-count, because both men are simply that damned good.

Watch Kozlov/Triple H/Hardy or Edge from Survivor Series when they tried technical wrestling. Watch the fact that most casual fans don't care for holds and what not. You have to remember when looking at Benoit/Angle/Malenko in WCW, they were promoted more as smash-mouth than technical. Sure, they used holds and what not, but they augmented it with some huge high-impact or flashy moves, making it more eye-pleasing and more exciting. Try doing that Bret/Shawn Ironman match today and it would be crapped on as the first 15 minutes were all holds and feeling out. The psychology was great, but the fans were invested in those characters then. Now...nothing of the sort for most people.

That said, I'm excited for this match only for the Hell in a Cell. I'm still of the opinion that last year, WWE would be in better position now if they had Barrett/Taker and Sheamus/Triple H as their matches given those feuds were coming to a head then and had good rationales for it. The problem with Triple H is that quite frankly, he's not the old Triple H anymore. He's slowed down and as it showed against Nash (which for the record, his matches against Nash in 2003 were rather good). He can't carry people anymore. His match against Punk was alright, but no one was hailing it as great. He's no longer that go-to guy, largely because of rust. Taker will be rusty, the thing is that I think he still can go well enough (as was showed in his appearances after facing Michaels the first time). It's more an issue that Taker needs someone that compliments him and can hide limitations while also telling a great story, at this stage. Trips is capable of it, but needs someone to dance with who can do that too. (Quick point, I'm not saying Punk is incapable. I think it was more that their match was solid, but required more gimmickry to make it work as the familiarity wasn't there)
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