Close Heel

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Close Heel; How To Achieve?
Topic Started: May 30 2007, 06:01 PM (366 Views)
WalkTerrier.TalkTerrier	May 30 2007, 06:01 PM Post #1
Chatterbox Posts: 828 Group: Full Members Member #143 Joined: November 29, 2005	Saff's improving her heel (Obedience type one, not just walk near me, dont pull, if you know the difference?) well, but she often goes a little too 'out' for my liking. If you watch competitions, the dog is practically glued to the handler, with nose up and on the leg. How can get this 99% of the time, instead of the 49% we have now?! Thanks :D



Tafia	May 30 2007, 11:50 PM Post #2
Total Gas Bag! Posts: 5,726 Group: Full Members Member #134 Joined: November 17, 2005	Dog only knows, I think you need to start with something like a less free thinking dog, say a Border Collie ;) Are you planning on doing Ob. Competitions or something?



WalkTerrier.TalkTerrier	May 31 2007, 12:56 PM Post #3
Chatterbox Posts: 828 Group: Full Members Member #143 Joined: November 29, 2005	I will not have a border collie :P I refuse :P My terrier can do everything a collie can do (ok, maybe not herding or producing more collies..!) ten times better than one :P And i'll show the world.. one day ;) I'm thinking about it. We're joining an obedience course to get her to concentrate more on me rather than other dogs, and when we've got that sorted i reckon she'll be rather good :D :lol: :angel:



PaulaK	Jun 4 2007, 10:57 AM Post #4
Moderator Posts: 7,823 Group: Moderators Member #110 Joined: August 26, 2005	Having a dog glued to your leg, like the collies and GSDs is not compulsary, as long as your dog keeps the same distance from you and the lead does not keep going tight you should not be penalised. You do need to work on keeping your dogs attention though so she doesn't keep sniffing and looking around, I would try to do this using your voice rather than food or toys as when you get in the ring you can't use these but you can say as much as you like in the lower classes.



Tafia	Jun 4 2007, 06:02 PM Post #5
Total Gas Bag! Posts: 5,726 Group: Full Members Member #134 Joined: November 17, 2005	WalkTerrier.TalkTerrier May 31 2007, 11:56 AM I will not have a border collie :P I refuse :P My terrier can do everything a collie can do (ok, maybe not herding or producing more collies..!) ten times better than one :P And i'll show the world.. one day ;) I've got to admit that I really don't like seeing dogs doing heel with their noses firmly pointed upwards, touching the handler - can't see that there's any benefit to it, seems way too controlling and unnatural. However, it wouldn't be the first time I've completely missed a logical reason for doing something - sooooo, my question; is there a logical reason for it other than just demonstrating extreme control?



RJL	Jun 4 2007, 09:20 PM Post #6
Chatterbox Posts: 1,364 Group: Full Members Member #179 Joined: January 25, 2006	Totally impractical to have a dog that is not looking where it is going :P The KC Field Officer at one of our breed shows was a KC obedience judge and he actually said that he dislikes seeing the 'extreme' heelwork because the rules say something to the effect that the position of the dog should not impede the movement of the handler and a lot of dogs seem to be almost crossing in front of the handler. He said this is something many collies do and is misinterpreted by many people nowadays as the 'ideal', when in fact it is not! I believe some handlers wear waistcoats and during training sesions have liver in the pockets so that in competition, the pockets are still smelly - even though they are empty :ph43r: and the waistcoat acts as an additional trigger to prompt the dog that teh behaviour is required and a reward will be available.



JRT	Jun 4 2007, 09:50 PM Post #7
Admin Posts: 11,759 Group: Admin Member #1 Joined: November 30, 2004	Sorry for my rather puny and uninformed input, but how the hell do you do the "collie walk" without trodding on the poor things feet :unsure:



ClaireS	Jun 5 2007, 09:10 AM Post #8
Moderator Posts: 10,392 Group: Moderators Member #113 Joined: September 8, 2005	How's about teaching a 'watch me' command? Archie can do this really well (unless he's seen his arch rival :rolleyes: ). It will get Saffi's attention onto you and can be really useful if you've got to walk past another dog that is kicking off. Also as I know you enjoy showing her you can do it round the ring and it will show her off at her most lovliest :D I don't do it so that Archie is glued to my knees - I get him walking at the usual distance from me as a normal slack-lead walk but focusing up at me. One thing I've learnt is to break the command before I get to a kerb :blush:



piwoodhouse	Jun 5 2007, 11:31 AM Post #9
Total Gas Bag! Posts: 3,970 Group: Full Members Member #282 Joined: August 18, 2006	Claire, how did you train Archie to do the "watch me" command?



PaulaK	Jun 5 2007, 11:49 AM Post #10
Moderator Posts: 7,823 Group: Moderators Member #110 Joined: August 26, 2005	Pam, with Dudley I sat and waited for him to look at my face then treated him once he was doing it consistently I started introducing the words 'Watch me' to him. With Thomas I just say 'Oi you little ginger git do you know who I am' and Suzi 'will you stop bouncing like some demented Tigger and concentrate'. :lol:



ClaireS	Jun 5 2007, 11:58 AM Post #11
Moderator Posts: 10,392 Group: Moderators Member #113 Joined: September 8, 2005	It wasn't that hard to do Pam because he's such a greedy guts :rolleyes: 1. Walking along show dog you have a treat in your hand then hold it up by your chest (as if you're trying to stop an imaginary button hole flower from falling out!). When dog has taken a few paces with his eyes on the treat give it to him with lots of praise (Or click and reward if clicker training). Don't treat if dog is bouncing for the treat! Repeat again and again.... then: 2. Next time you hold the treat up start saying 'watch me' - the second his head turns and his eyes look up at you click or say 'good' and reward. 3. Start to lengthen the time between click and reward or 'good' and reward. 4. Try the command without a treat, just a finger held up against your chest. Click / 'good' & Reward for following the command. I tend to give the voice command at the same time as making the hand signal; you could try doing one without the other but I think they work well together especially for road walking. That way the person coming at me with their dog can see I'm giving my dog a command - hopefully if they are considerate people they will keep theirs under control :whistle: These days Archie will look at me straight away if there is nothing going on, if there are other dogs about he'll have a look around first to make sure he's not going to miss out on a shouting match :rolleyes: For WTTT the next challenge might be to perfect a 'watch me' with just voice command alone if its going to be used in the ring?



Tafia	Jun 5 2007, 05:26 PM Post #12
Total Gas Bag! Posts: 5,726 Group: Full Members Member #134 Joined: November 17, 2005	RJL Jun 4 2007, 08:20 PM Totally impractical to have a dog that is not looking where it is going :P The KC Field Officer at one of our breed shows was a KC obedience judge and he actually said that he dislikes seeing the 'extreme' heelwork because the rules say something to the effect that the position of the dog should not impede the movement of the handler and a lot of dogs seem to be almost crossing in front of the handler. He said this is something many collies do and is misinterpreted by many people nowadays as the 'ideal', when in fact it is not! I believe some handlers wear waistcoats and during training sesions have liver in the pockets so that in competition, the pockets are still smelly - even though they are empty :ph43r: and the waistcoat acts as an additional trigger to prompt the dog that teh behaviour is required and a reward will be available. My thoughts exactly .... I have to say that I have never, ever seen a working collie naturally exhibiting anything like the behaviour described though it would be easy to imagine exactly how one would get them to do this by appealling to the naturally "anal retentive" part of their personality. Some do however try to "herd" anything and everything which is perhaps where this has come from. Think there's nothing so lovely as seeing someone and their dog, walking happily side by side in full and equal partnership, the other smacks far too much of servitude for me. However, having read ClaireS very informative post I can see that there are some circumstances in which it has it's uses.



WalkTerrier.TalkTerrier	Jun 17 2007, 03:14 PM Post #13
Chatterbox Posts: 828 Group: Full Members Member #143 Joined: November 29, 2005	Thanks Claire :D Will try that. I dont mean the one with their heads practically breaking off of their necks, just a more 'close' one :P . :grad:



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