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| The "Leave it!!" command; Only working part time for us! | |
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| Topic Started: Feb 21 2009, 01:24 AM (221 Views) | |
| piwoodhouse | Feb 21 2009, 01:24 AM Post #1 |
Total Gas Bag!
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Widget's training course includes us holding a favourite titbit on the palm of the hand and telling him to leave it - he does this brilliantly in the class. At home, when his food bowl goes down I again tell him to leave it and bless him, he won't touch it until I give the "Take it" command. This morning, he stole Johnny's Nutella sandwich off the plate. I tried my best, calmest, most authoritative "LEAVE IT!!!!!!!" and he responded by dodging him, Martha and I, clattering into the sitting room in pure slapstick comedy mode and galloping out into the garden, wolfing this sandwich as he went. Nutella chocolate spread being so cloying, he was having a bit of trouble guzzling it down and was forced to stop a few times; I walked up to him, repeating the Leave It command in what I think was a fairly stern voice but one devoid of panic and the little sod just glugged and retched more furiously and ran off again. By the time I managed to stop him, there was a sliver of crust left. All amusement aside, how do I graduate from the controlled Leave It to a Leave It Whenever I say Even If It Makes No Sense To You? When we're in the garden and out on walks and I tell him to Leave the ball, he drops it more or less on the spot, so this is a question of him giving up high value treats immediately. Edited by piwoodhouse, Feb 21 2009, 01:25 AM.
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| zandd | Feb 21 2009, 01:57 PM Post #2 |
Moderator
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Watches as well,Daisy will do a perfect leave it indoors or if I place a treat down myself outdoors - however any titbit she finds herself is fair game and the command is totally ignored :err: |
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| Tafia | Feb 21 2009, 05:13 PM Post #3 |
Total Gas Bag!
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With my two it all depends on their spaciel awareness, at home no problem with anything. On walks no problem again as long as they are within a certain radius. Outside that radius I can see their brain working out if I'm near enough to step in effectively. Boo will go one further, execute a perfect leave it, walk on lulling me into a false sense of security until I've forgotten all about it and waits until my back is turned. With the speed of light she then doubles back and retrieves the item - even if it's two fields away!
Edited by Tafia, Feb 21 2009, 05:14 PM.
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| Linda & Fred | Feb 21 2009, 05:37 PM Post #4 |
Chatterbox
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You have to practice on everything, regularly, and have alternatives dotted about the house or in your pockets to offer as an immediate reward. It's taken a long time, but Fred will now leave MOST things in MOST circumstances, but I think sometimes they just what they've got more than anything and we just have to accept that. I use treats, but for REALLY important 'leaves' (usually when children are around) I use a squeaky toy that he ONLY gets in those circumstances. I had to work really hard as I live opposite a chippy so we often find chicken bones on our local walks (and in the garden :x:), so the first thing I did was watch Fred like a hawk in controlled circumstances so I could get a successful 'leave' and reward before he had it in his mouth, and often before he even moved as I would say it as soon as he made eye contact. You have to be careful with terriers you don't say it before they've seen something too often, because then it becomes a cue to look around for something to scavenge! Fred will leave on command and even spit out if I've been late noticing. The only exception is I haven't yet been able to get a reliable leave when he's been offered or thrown something, but it's coming along. We're also working on leaving balls alone, which is doubly difficult because he loves them so much they were his original reward when training his recall away from big distractions, but it's essential the closer summer comes. This summer I am determined he can come offlead in parks (probably still with his muzzle on for one last year) when kids are playing because his recall is ball-proof! Personally I never tell him to leave his food bowl, although I do say 'take it' as I put it down. It's his food, he knows it's his food and I NEVER allow him to have something I've told him to leave. Leave means 'leave that alone and have this instead'. I don't want him thinking if I say leave he can have it later when perhaps I'm not looking, but that's not to say I don't think anyone else should stick to that, it's just what works for us. |
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| Sky | Feb 21 2009, 08:15 PM Post #5 |
Chatterbox
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I am hoping that the "leave it" comand will come into force when we get the chickens but I am not sure whether it will work so I will probably end up leaving dogs inside when chickens are out to be on the safe side :yes: |
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| piwoodhouse | Feb 22 2009, 05:30 PM Post #6 |
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Total Gas Bag!
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Thanks so much for all the advice and point taken Eco Warrior about the food bowl. I think you're right and I haven't been crediting Widget with the intelligence to know the difference between what he is free to take and what he shouldn't touch. No quick fix here, but having terriers I'm used to a bit of hard graft! First things first: Johnny can write out 500 times in his best writing "I will not leave chocolate spread sandwiches at Cairn height". |
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| Linda & Fred | Feb 22 2009, 10:37 PM Post #7 |
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Chatterbox
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I don't know if this might be the case, but I found when I let people feed my previous dog from their plates, he started stealing. Before that I could leave my food unattended and he wouldn't touch it. Then I started having a gang of friends come round once a week and they brought chips. One in particular fed him the odd chip and I had to stop it before Buster would stop stealing again. Could it be someone is sneakily giving Widget bits of food? We went to a different park today, and there were lots of kids about so I took TWO squeaky toys so I would never be without something to throw for him. As we were on our way back to the car a family walked towards us, the boy dribbling a ball. I took note, and of course he gave it a kick right in front of Fred. I managed to get him to chase his squeaky instead. Result! :D I am not sure if it's teaching him to actually 'leave' but at least he didn't go and grab it! |
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| piwoodhouse | Feb 23 2009, 01:34 AM Post #8 |
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Total Gas Bag!
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I'd say anything is possible....BUT far more likely is the fact he's just an opportunistic greedy guts. He requires an armed guard when the children put bread out for the birds as it is. Fantastic news about Fred :yay: :yay: :yay: |
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| Laura | Feb 24 2009, 08:05 PM Post #9 |
One of the regulars
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Love the way you described the situation! Sounds brill! I think you just have to practice. But I read somewhere/was told that in a pack of dogs no puppy or other dog would be told off by the alpha if they did manage to steal a bit of food from under their nose. Probably why it's so hard to teach them to leave the bit's they hoover off the floor! Sally has a good leave. Meg does if she feels like it but the other day a huge bee landed a foot in front of her and she went to snap it up, I panicked and screamed 'no meg leave it' and waved my arms around like a loony. She definitely left it, but I might have traumatized the poor thing! Are you doing this to work towards the kc exam thingy? |
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| piwoodhouse | Feb 24 2009, 10:26 PM Post #10 |
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Total Gas Bag!
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Yes - he's taking his Bronze on March 10th. He was fairly good tonight though he seems determined NOT to do the nice straight 'sit' that the others have down to a tee: instead he's perfected a casual, semi-leaning style that allows him to participate while simultaneously providing easy access to lick his own bits. And he continually mugged for treats. The teacher did ask us not to feed them before class but even she was giggling when in the recall exercise (lead taken off, dog on left hand side of room, owner walks to opposite side of room, turns, waits 5 seconds, calls dog) he did THE most exaggerated detour to snaffle up a speck of corned beef carelessly dropped by Rhys the Giant Schnauzer. |
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| Linda & Fred | Feb 25 2009, 08:42 AM Post #11 |
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Chatterbox
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The instructor is expecting a hungry dog to do food refusal at bronze level? Not sure I think that's a good idea! Good luck with the test though. |
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| piwoodhouse | Feb 25 2009, 03:09 PM Post #12 |
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Total Gas Bag!
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Eek- 2 weeks to go and this has worried me. Should I disregard what she says then do you think? I feed him after class at 8.30pm but he does get a snack after morning walk. |
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| Linda & Fred | Feb 25 2009, 09:32 PM Post #13 |
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Chatterbox
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I think you should give your dog his best chance to do well. If he's training and you are using food as a reward then in the early days it makes sense that he's peckish but not so hungry he can't concentrate, so for evening training I'd feed breakfast and then tea when we got home. But if you are using food to train, then to offer him food and expect him to know the difference (especially if he is used to people other than you giving him treats) seems a bit like setting him up to fail. He might think the food is his and you are telling him to leave something else. I'd feed him enough to take the edge of his hunger before the test and possibly even training to give him the best chance for the next couple of weeks, but you know him best.I found it helped that we were tested for bronze at a dog show, so Fred wasn't somewhere he was used to taking food. I didn't mean to worry you though! Is Widget clicker trained? You could work on it with a clicker at home. |
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| piwoodhouse | Feb 25 2009, 11:25 PM Post #14 |
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Total Gas Bag!
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I wish I'd persevered with clicker training - sadly, I felt I was never getting the timing right and worried I'd end up confusing him, so it kind of died a death after a week or so. I'm certainly more confident with him generally now though so might have another look at it. But you're right - the trainer's advice is bound to be generic and not tailored to my dog in any way. |
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| Linda & Fred | Feb 26 2009, 09:14 AM Post #15 |
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Chatterbox
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There are things you can do to improve your timing if you are interested, but I've found that different clickers have different speeds! I've got clickers all around my house in case Fred does something I want to capture, or we have a bit of spontaneous training, and sometimes I click wrong because I've picked up a crappy clicker. I should chuck them out and stick to the same type, but never seem to have enough of the good ones! |
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