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| Plumbing problems ~Help! | |
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| Topic Started: Feb 12 2017, 09:30 AM (521 Views) | |
| swing | Feb 12 2017, 09:30 AM Post #1 |
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swing
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Every spring or when the weather changes from cold to warm we have problems with the main floor toilet, more so since they worked on the water lines in the area. Thursday night it wouldn't drain full of air locks just gurgles and bubbles up. The problem being after shutting off the water and plunging begins an air lock appears and you guessed floods it over flows and floods the bathroom. Towels in play and prevented major damage just water dripped down to the basement bath which has a cedar ceiling, a blessing. I plunged yesterday and got it cleared, it was used several times with no problem, now won't clear again. I turn water off, plunge gently, air lock appears again and a repeat performance of Thursday night. I am so damn frustrated with cleaning up water and washing towels, what's the solution here? Never before has this air lock thing pushed the water over the bowl when the water is turned off. Why does it clear for a day then repeat the scenario? To make things even more interesting, we have H.W. throughout including the bathrooms, fools that we were! We bailed the thing and it's sitting now with water turned off. Advice plumbers/ handymen? |
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| Dialtone | Feb 12 2017, 10:09 AM Post #2 |
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Gold Star Member
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I'm no plumber, but in winter the main stack can freeze shut due to warm humid air, and cause all sorts of problems with air locks, poor flushing, and/or sucking the traps dry. It's been pretty cold (off and on) since Dec with lots of snow this year, so I would check your roof stack to make sure it isn't blocked with ice or snow. One article but lots more online. http://homes.winnipegfreepress.com/winnipeg-real-estate-articles/renovation-design/Vent-blockage-a-common-cold-climate-problem/id-3689 Edited to add: Sewer pipes have to be vented to allow air into the pipe for proper flow. The sewer pipe and vent pipes are connected so wastewater flows downward and sewer gases rise. During extended periods of very cold weather, sewer gas containing water vapor will condense, then freeze to form a frost layer in the exposed uninsulated end of the vent pipe. This frost layer can seal the pipe partially or fully, forming a plug. Hard, drifted snow also can plug the end of the vent pipes. If the end of the vent pipe is plugged, proper draining will be hampered and air will be pulled into the piping, which will drain the traps of water fixtures. This allows sewer gas into the house. The gas, primarily composed of methane and carbon monoxide, will have an obvious “sewer” smell; however, some harmful gases are odorless. “The first indication of trouble may be the toilet gurgling or not flushing properly as water is pulled from the traps to replace existing water and air flow,” Scherer says. “Sewer gas may cause people to become sick with symptoms such as headache, nausea and/or dizziness.” https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/news/newsreleases/2014/oct-20-2014/now-is-time-to-protect-sewer-vents-from-freezing/ Edited by Dialtone, Feb 12 2017, 10:12 AM.
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| swing | Feb 12 2017, 10:48 AM Post #3 |
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swing
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Thanks D.T. no evidence of sewer gases. We have had trouble with flushing periodically with the top floor toilets, but they are now fine. Wouldn't you think it would affect them all, however this article makes sense, now to figure out]where the plumbing stack is?? I will send this on to my academic husband ~sigh! Thanks again! |
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| Delphi51 | Feb 12 2017, 10:53 AM Post #4 |
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Indeed it sounds like a clogged vent stack. When we last discussed this I resolved to put insulation around the vent pipe in the attic but failed to do it last fall. We have a metal roof so I can't easily pour hot water in from the top any more. |
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| Dialtone | Feb 12 2017, 11:36 AM Post #5 |
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Gold Star Member
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Swing, I see Edmonton is experiencing a warm streak starting today with temps up to +8 or so next week. (we are forecast for chinooks and +19 on Wednesday, yahoo.. but I'll believe it when I see it ) The problem might fix itself if it's a vent plugged with ice/snow, so maybe just keep your fingers crossed and see what happens. In our previous house we used to experience a plugged vent most winters due to location of the stack, if it's on the snow drift or shade side of the roof it can get worse than the sunny warm side of the roof. |
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| swing | Feb 12 2017, 01:03 PM Post #6 |
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swing
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This is my Dh's solution wait a couple days! He does know where the stack is, says it's not on the roof, perhaps he will check it between sporting events tomorrow! Yes we are supposed to have +9 by Thursday, 19 is even better ~ enjoy and Thanks again to you and Delphi ~appreciate. |
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| wildie | Feb 12 2017, 04:07 PM Post #7 |
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Veteran Member
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We had our lead service lines replaced on our street last year. My neighbor had a similar problem to yours. A plumber was hired and he had a TV camera that he fed down the pipe in order to see what the problem was. It turned out that the old soil pipe was made of fired clay and it collapsed from the vibrations that came from the excavation machines that were used to dig up the road. The plumber had to dig dig down to the damaged section and replace it. The worse part of this was that the pipe ran under a concrete walk and this had to be removed. |
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| swing | Feb 12 2017, 05:31 PM Post #8 |
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swing
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They installed new main lines through here, had the street dug up for three months. It was not our street but a couple blocks over on the main street into the area. Every spring we have problems with the toilet on the main however the ones on the upper level this year as well. The upper level are presently fine ( touch wood). I'm becoming paranoid though almost afraid to flush the damn things. The basement one is fine never had a problem with it, guess I'll have to travel two floors to pee lol! |
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| wildie | Feb 13 2017, 02:47 AM Post #9 |
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Veteran Member
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If your lower toilet is a problem but the upper is OK, I would think that the problem is inside your house. I heard of a case where there was a problem and it turned out to be a problem with the drain in the toilet, itself. A new toilet resolved the problem. Rather than keep on worrying about your plumbing, I would recommend that you would have a plumber come in. I'm a DYIer big time, but when it comes to plumbing I call in the professionals. The pro's have the equipment to deal with such problems. When I worked at the university I could borrow tools to deal with blockages, now in retirement I back off from anything that requires special tools. There has been mention of ice building up in the vent stack and if this is what is happening, I would think that it would affect both toilets, as they generally share the same stack! |
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| Trotsky | Feb 13 2017, 03:12 AM Post #10 |
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Big City Boy
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My first try would be with a closet augur, aka toilet augur. Do you know someone you can borrow one from? If the situation is recurrent you might want to buy one. Bob has a propensity to clog out new low flow toilet but it is not his fault, the toilet exit flows into a much larger common pipe and thus it loses its siphon. We just run downstairs into the maintenance room and grab their augur for 5 minutes work. "Gurgles and bubbles up" is exactly what ours does (but not for many months now...Huzzah.) When I call Bob a "big shit" he has no deniability. laugh123 Posted Image $9.22 at Home Depot If it is indeed a frozen vent stack I would first do a climb up on the roof CAREFULLY with a kettle (or something bigger) full of boiling water. But if, as you say, the problem occurs when cold weather turns to warm, I would put more credence in the augur rather than in defrosting the vent stack. With my Mr. Imagination hat on, I can envision, when the weather warms, a melting of ice, frost, and snow in the vent melting to a sloppy slush and falling to a low spot (your ground floor) and causing a plug there. If you can get to the exit pipe at that low point it should feel colder than the rest of the pipe. Maybe apply slow heat to that spot with a heating pad, a hair dryer, or a gentle torch. Another thought, try several flushes of hot, not boiling, water upstairs to warm the whole piping system...you might get lucky. Don't use boiling water...you don't want to crack your porcelain god. Edited by Trotsky, Feb 13 2017, 03:32 AM.
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| Delphi51 | Feb 13 2017, 07:37 PM Post #11 |
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Hmmm, basement toilet works, higher up ones not. Blockage somewhere in between? I expect a main floor toilet would have to be taken out and a snake run down from there to sort that out. No doubt all the plumbers now have snakes with video cameras so they can see problems in the pipes. Edited by Delphi51, Feb 14 2017, 06:08 AM.
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| Trotsky | Feb 14 2017, 02:41 AM Post #12 |
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Big City Boy
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I understood the problem to be "main floor overflows, upper floors okay." No mention of basement toilet working but maybe I missed something. |
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| swing | Feb 14 2017, 05:04 AM Post #13 |
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swing
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I understood the problem to be "main floor overflows, upper floors okay." No mention of basement toilet working but maybe I missed something. Right you are, although the upper floor main overflowed a couple weeks ago, working fine ( touch wood) now! I'm inclined to think as D.T. mentioned it's something to do with the freeze and thaw situation present at this time. Every spring we have this problem with the main, however it's resting at the moment! Wednesday it's to be +10 here so will see what happens, a plumber will be summoned if it continues. Plumbers are so expensive, been here 28 years and have not found a reasonable one. One guy charged us over 700.00 to fix a leak under the sink, a new garburetor and installation. I was furious, but DH is not handy so we have to pay the price, however do they have to be such vultures! We even supplied lunch for the 700.00 guy ~ :sigh: Edited to say never have had a problem with the basement one in 28 years, should I say this? Edited by swing, Feb 14 2017, 05:06 AM.
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| FuzzyO | Feb 14 2017, 05:36 AM Post #14 |
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It's OK Swing, I knocked on wood as soon as I read it! |
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| Trotsky | Feb 15 2017, 03:57 AM Post #15 |
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Big City Boy
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swing's toilet: Posted Image Edited by Trotsky, Feb 15 2017, 03:58 AM.
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