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| Your LBT movie; What do you want to see in a LBT sequel? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Feb 27 2005, 10:24:18 AM (1,685 Views) | |
| Littlefoot1616 | Feb 27 2005, 10:24:18 AM Post #1 |
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The Inquisitive Quadruped (admin)
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'Sup peeps! I've not too long seen LBT 11 (via the web thanks to Threehorn) and I then when on to read Arvens section where he reviewed the movie. I'm not gonna get personal with the matter but I personally liked it. Quality was a bit iffy now and again but that's web connections for you! :rolleyes: In light of what was said and what has been said about the previous LBT sequels, I've been constantly wondering, particularly to those who DIDN'T like the recent flicks: 1. What makes you dislike them some much? - Was it going into the film with a negative view that just carried all the way through prior to not liking the one before it? Is it the plot? Animation? voices? What did it that switched you off? 2. If what you see is not doing for you, what DO you want to see? As a LBT fan I'm kinda let down by what's been said recently. Of course everyone's entitled to their opinion but all I've heard so far is complaint and moaning and no reasons why. There must be something that kicks it off. Originality lost? Lack of story? Poor editting? As a fan, what elements do you think are needed to restore the faith and love we all had for the very first one? The channels open if you wish to speak into it... |
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| Mirumoto_Kenjiro | Feb 27 2005, 05:21:35 PM Post #2 |
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Cera
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I too have just seen LBT 11 (so that just leaves me with 8 & 10), and overall, I personally think it was a good movie too. It's kind of hard to try and compare it to the original, simply because the plots in both movies are too different. The original was about a group of young dinosaurs separated from their families and they have to overcome their predjudices to find the Great Valley. The LBT 11 sequel was made to teach how much damage is made when somebody tells a lie (and I've known to a degree of that damage through experience... ), plus a little side moral about Cera trying to cope with change when Tria comes into the picture, like a child trying to deal with a stepparent.The only things that I wasn't too happy with LBT 11 (and perhaps a few later films) was that they were trying to incorporate CG animation into it. The only other thing that turned my head away was the adults singing (but it's no too different from other movies )That's pretty much all I had to say about this for now. Feel free to disagree. |
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| Malte279 | Feb 28 2005, 05:02:57 PM Post #3 |
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I'm a historian. I MUST be like that!
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Hi! I haven't seen LBT 11 yet, but I'm a notorious critic of LBT 10. I would be extremely disappointed by another movie of the same level.
Quite frankly, I do take this statement somewhat awry. <_< Not because of different opinions (I can't emphasize often enough that I appreciate opinions different from my own) but because it shows that my messages are obviously not being read. I have given page long accounts on WHY I dislike LBT 10 and parts of other recent LBT movies. I have given long lists of reasons for my disapproval of the movie. Being told that no reasons were given is thus pretty hard to swallow for me, the much the more as I never got any response attempting to disprove any of my points. I don't think that there is anything I would be more grateful for than anybodies successful attempt to make me think higher of LBT 10. I have very frequently pointed out what I dissapprove about LBT 10 and some other recent LBT movies, but here we go again: First and most important the "realism" of the stories. Of course "realism" is a term to be handled with care if we are talking of stories about talking dinosaurs, yet I'm talking of the realism refering to things that would have worked out in the original movie and the first few sequels and things that would not. The explanation for Bron's absence in all the previous LBT sequels and Littlefoot's mother or grandparents never mentioning him is absolutely unsatisfactory! Not only is there a number of general discrepancies (which I pointed out in another thread about Bron) but also direct contradictions to earlier movies. Another thing about the realism is what I'd like to call the "taming down of the sharpteeth". Just take a look at the sharptooth from the original movie or the sequels 2, 5, 6 or 9 and you'll know what I mean. Young dinosaur kids aren't supposed to crawl under a sharptooth's foot in order to trip it (like Shorty did). If a dinosaur kid did this not the sharptooth would trip, but the kid would be squeezed! Sharpteeth ought not to fall down immediately if a few pebbles are thrown in front of their feet or if a big snowball is rolled at them. They made things far too easy for themselves! Reading about sharpteeth being tickled in LBT 11 is to me the most disturbing thing I've yet read about LBT 11. I'm in no mood to write down the countless other unrealistic elements about which I have written before. You can find them in other threads and respond to them if you see any good explanation for any of the discrepancies I presented there. Next we have the animation. Of course others may think differently, but I consider it a very stupid effect to turn the sky, the landscape and (in LBT 10) even the characters red in case of danger. It really seems quite exaggerated and almost ridiculous to me, especially with the landscape and everything turning normal within an instant once the danger is over. 3D effects and photorealistic stuff can be fitted into LBT very well. They did a very good job for example with the photorealistic water in the 9th movie. However sometime they force the stuff into the movies no matter how good or bad it fits. In LBT 10 for example we have photorealistic tree branches and skies which really don't seem to fit at all to the rest of the normally drawn landscapes. |
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| JojotheIncredible | Mar 1 2005, 02:59:46 AM Post #4 |
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From the Future
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To exceed the level of quality of the first movie. |
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| Littlefoot1616 | Mar 1 2005, 06:26:42 AM Post #5 |
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The Inquisitive Quadruped (admin)
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But is that all it is Malte?! Realism?! I know you're not one for fantasy but it's very tempting to say "It's a cartoon for pete's sake!" Very few movies are out there to be taken literally, especially cartoons! There is supposed to be a certain amount of SURrealism otherwise they should have shot it in real time rather than animating it. Also, why just #10?! One flick that's under par in your opinion and you can't look to it anymore! That's what I don't understand! I heard from a special guest director at my uni who came to speak to us about tv/film production and he said: "In order to be successful in the industry, you gotta make 10 crap movies/episodes before your first good one". Obviously this is a professional's quotation to put the idea of working in the industry into scope and there are exceptions. And yet again, my question was not answered. I just got a post full of whining about what's WRONG and not what you think should have been done instead. I never said I was attempting to changes people's views on any particular LBT movie they feel was not up to standard. Im not pinpointing this on Malte, but so far you've been my key example.
What would you WANT to see that MAKES it the level you want it to be at?! I've read countless times the criticism of LBT 10 but that's where it was left. Rather than hunting for a problem...why not hunt for a solution?! Please understand Malte that Im not having a dig at you personally so please dont take it that way. But I hate to see and hear (even in real life situations) people moaning just for the sake of it and when offered a solution or the chance to express what they feel can be done about it, they just turn their backs on it! If it's the realism that's a pain, what do you want to be done about it? Say WHY's it's a pain rather than WHERE is it. I'm still interested to hear other's thoughts on this... |
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| Malte279 | Mar 2 2005, 12:08:29 PM Post #6 |
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I'm a historian. I MUST be like that!
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Hi! It's not fantasy I'm oposing. Yet I think there is an important difference; one ought to draw a line where fantasy ends and indolence of the story tellers begin. For indolence it is if they don't bother at all to make their stories conform with the previous movies. I think there is a tollerable amount of unrealistic story elements. In LBT 9 for example Petrie could have certainly crossed the landbreak by just flying a little higher. In movies like LBT 10, 8 and partly LBT 7 however they story tellers avoid problems by just creating a world in which a sharptooth will be defeated by a longneck kid crawling under its food. They also created an image of the world in LBT 1 which was just false. They avoided almost all the conflicts and problems that would have made a good story. To me the land before time is not just a cartoon for Pete's sake, and because I care very much about LBT it makes me sick to see how they change it for the worse. When I'm talking of LBT 10 in particular it is because I consider that one the worst of all. Like I said there are quite questionable elements in LBT 8 and 7 too. In LBT 8 they roll a snowball down a mountain and even though he is much closer to it Mr. Thicknose is able to step out of the way, while the sharptooth just stands there watching the snowball untill it hits him. In LBT 7 it was the leaving of the rainbowfaces in particular that bothered me. I know that you are less demanding than I am concerning keeping non LBT like elements such as aliens or humans out of LBT. As for your claim that I can't look at a movie anymore if there is one flick that is under par in my opinion, you will find that all the problems I have with LBT 10 makes quite long a list of flicks. You'll also find that I'm not rioting against LBT 7 and 8 even though there is more than one flick that is under par in my opinion. So I don't think that this reproach is really fustified. If movie makers need to make crap movies in order to be successful later on I'd prefer them not to make crap LBT movies, and as Mr Grosvenor created some really good sequels already, I don't think that this is the reason for the decreasing quality of the sequels anyway. As for how I'd like an LBT movie to be made the answer is quite simple and in a way it was given already. If all the negative points I listed about LBT 10 were avoided in a land before time sequel, I'm quite confident that it would be a pretty good one. Sometimes not even an elaborate storyline is necessary to make a good story. The plot of LBT 9 for example was actually quite simple and yet the movie itself was really good in my opinion. If you've read my critics of LBT 10 countless times I as you say I find it a bit strange though that nevertheless you claimed that no reasons for my dislike of LBT 10 were given. And with the problems being addressed like that I really don't think that this is to be considered moaning for the sake of it. I did say WHY I have problems with the scenes I always criticize. I'm going to quote some pessages of my earlier land before time critics and underline the parts where I made direct suggestions on how it could have been done better:
Looking at this I really think that it is unfair to claim that I wouldn't make any suggestions on how they should do it! This text certainly isn't mere whining! |
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| Petrie | Mar 5 2005, 12:54:05 PM Post #7 |
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GOF Founder
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Ok, if I had a choice, I wouldn't even make a sequel because most every sequel to any film I've ever seen I've hated. The lone exception is Shrek 2 where I liked the sequel more than the first film. Why do I hate them? Because with films I feel that if you're going to tell a story, tell me something I haven't heard before. With sequels they continue on something that I have already seen. Personally, I don't want to see any more LBT films; they can't make a sequel I will enjoy. Know why? These films are made for people that are 13 years my junior. Age is a big one. Indeed, I do love animation, but I'm into alot of the more dark/exotic animated films that you just can't watch and say "Ok, that was fun," without thinking about them or having some type of emotional feel. My last two films that I bought were Animal Farm (1954) and All Dogs Go to Heaven, and neither of these animated films are just something you can "enjoy". There are deeper meanings to both of these films, and that's what I like pondering over. An LBT film can never do that because they will miss their target audience by miles instead of inches. |
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| Malte279 | Mar 7 2005, 04:53:14 AM Post #8 |
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I'm a historian. I MUST be like that!
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I do not agree with that. Much as I love the original movie I seriously doubt that the original movie by itself would have done to capture me as much as LBT as a whole did. In my opinion there are some really very good sequels, and I still hope that there will be more good sequels without elements such as those which I considered shortcomings of the sequels 7, 8 and 10. I do agree that there could be a little more gloom, a little more stuff to think about in the LBT movies. Too much of it however doesn't suit LBT well either. There is a good deal of gloomy elements in the LBT story I'm writing right now and also in most of the stories I'm planing on. Anyway, I definitely DON'T share your implied hatred of the sequels! I would seriously miss most of the sequels. |
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| Petrie | Mar 7 2005, 06:10:24 PM Post #9 |
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GOF Founder
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I'm going to quote Jason since he says this all the time: to each his own. ![]() As for what you said about missing the sequels, that's only because there are sequels. If there were no LBT sequels, you wouldn't be missing anything, and your opinion would be much different if we were proposing they make a sequel rather than what would be an ideal sequel after what we've seen. ![]() |
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| Malte279 | Mar 9 2005, 08:05:48 AM Post #10 |
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I'm a historian. I MUST be like that!
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Of course I couldn't in fact miss anything without it ever existing. However, to name just one of the certain effects if the sequels hadn't ever been produced, I wouldn't know any of you! From my current situation point of view this would be really quite a miss, and pointing out that I wouldn't miss you or anything without knowing that you or it exists seems a bit like hairsplitting to me. Of course I don't know what I would've won had I used the time differently I spend in the GOF, the forums, writing emails or my stories or whatever... I guess it's pointless to dwell on that. |
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| Petrie | Mar 9 2005, 08:12:32 PM Post #11 |
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GOF Founder
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...post removed... I had second thoughts about it. -_- |
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| Littlefoot1616 | Mar 10 2005, 06:07:56 AM Post #12 |
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The Inquisitive Quadruped (admin)
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Gotta side with Malte on that one. How can you possibly have a liking for something that doesn't exist or is never heard of? The whole idea, from a business perspective, was to create a sequel to LBT because it was deemed profitable and it had scope to do well...and it has! The LBT saga is one of the most successful direct-to-video feature films and it's raked in tens of millions in net profit. From a fan-based perspective (from what I can gather from what I've read) it seems to be very hit-n-miss whether people like it or not. Obviously, different people see different elements to others and some can read deeper messages than others. As Arvens has quoted me from before...EACH TO THEIR OWN! At the end of the day, it's down to the individual to decide if they like or or lump it. |
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| Petrie | Mar 10 2005, 11:02:19 AM Post #13 |
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GOF Founder
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*nods* Even with longtime fans it's hit or miss. Moneywise, so long as people who live by them buy them, then they'll keep making LBT videos. Most of the big dissenters (the ones that won't even pick up an LBT film sequel) say that its success is the reason they've gone too far....to them, the continuation means that the quality suffers the further they try to stretch the series. That's generally what I pick out every time I see another review starting with "Another one????" |
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| Littlefoot1616 | Mar 11 2005, 05:41:38 AM Post #14 |
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The Inquisitive Quadruped (admin)
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I don't see it that way... Obviously these kind of people (without stereotyping or pinpointing this on anyone) see something slightly unusual and they immediately turn their nose up at it and very few seem interested! From there, the only thing they do is then blast it for every square inch of it's entirity. This is what I personally can't stand! "Oh! It's another LBT...when's it gonna stop!?!" People are so ready to see something fail or be killed off rather than admire it for its a). continuity and/or B). success. Some of my most favourite videos and games I own I picked up without knowing a single detail and thought "Meh...I'll give it a shot" and I adore them! I've still got them and watch/play them today from over a decade ago! I've even had games I've sold off (there's a story to me selling them but I won't go into it here) forgotten about them for numerous years and had the exact same cartridge returned to my collection again when I found it in a second hand shop! Getting back to LBT, I don't see any areas where plot/story/animation/foley/voices etc have faultered. There are ocassions where I pick up on possible errors (eg. the biggest culprit seems to be confusion on colour segments of characters. Like, when Littlefoot is asking Mo about wanting to go home and Mo nods, one of Mo's eye patches flickers from red to purple. Check it out if you didn't notice it) Despite these little errors, none of the LBT sequels put me off watching them nor does it hinder me from wanting to obtain the next available sequel. Far from it! I'm usually waiting outside a nearest video/DVD retailer before the store's even opened to grab my copy. The thought of renting it first has NEVER crossed my mind coz I just have so much faith in the saga that I know I WONT be disappointed. Even my least favourite sequels I watch. It seems to me that people (not so much fans of LBT) don't like the sound of another LBT movie because it IS a feature film! If it was a new episode to say a television cartoon series shown on kid's TV on Saturday morning that had been transplanted to video, no one would give a monkey's! (I had to be careful with my choice of words there coz I was going to be very blatent and loose-jawed but I kept control as always! ) I'm sorry but why should people get to voice their opinions when they know nothing about it! To me, that's being prejudice and an unnecessary passing unfair judgement. :angry:
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| Threehorn | Mar 11 2005, 06:25:35 AM Post #15 |
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Still me inside but different on the outside
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I agree with you there about the unfair judgement... only because some lost the taste of land before time doesn't mean that they have to shame it for the hell of it because they had zero interest in it now. I on the other hand love watching it no matter what others say -Threehorn |
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| Malte279 | Mar 11 2005, 07:07:53 AM Post #16 |
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I'm a historian. I MUST be like that!
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Despite the assurance that the judgement wasn't pinpointed to anyone I still feel that I need to point out some facts to make sure that I'm not secretly seen in a wrong light. I LOVE LBT and I DO want the series to continue! I'm certainly NOT somebody to turn my nose up on a series just because many sequels have been produced of it already. I AM quite willing to let myself be proven wrong in any negative estimations towards elements in LBT. The best example for this is probably my first reaction at the sight of Mo on the cover of LBT 9 ("Help! Pokemons invading LBT!") compared to my reaction after seeing the movie (I consider LBT 9 the best of the recent sequels). Some people here will know especially well that I'm very willing to deal with stuff I'm prejudiced about trying to form an objective opinion about it. Perhaps it is appropriate to quote some passages of my original critizism of LBT 10 (to be found in the network54 forum and the old GOF) which I didn't quote before thinking that these passages got nothing to do with the topic:
I certainly have NOT lost interest in the land before time (if I had I wouldn't continue spending a significant percentage of my lifetime in LBT forums, writing LBT stories or gathering/creating fanart for the LBT gallery)! I think that some of the producers of LBT may have lost touch with what I may call the "gist" or the "spirit" of the earlier LBT movies. Criticizing this in an argument based manner (who has ever heard me complaining without saying WHAT I'm complaining about) is not to be considered mere slandering or "unfair judgement". I don't mean to quarrel. But in my defense I have to say that I really can't help thinking that I showed far more readiness to deal with statements in favor of LBT 10 or elements I disapproved of, than anyone of an oppinion different of my own showed readiness to deal with the critical points of LBT 10 I pointed out. |
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| Malte279 | Mar 11 2005, 08:31:31 AM Post #17 |
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I'm a historian. I MUST be like that!
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I guess I'm a little fidgety these days, so I took some stuff too personally feeling addressed for my critizism of LBT 10 in particular. I beg your pardon if I overreacted.
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| Littlefoot1616 | Mar 11 2005, 08:31:40 AM Post #18 |
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The Inquisitive Quadruped (admin)
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OK...there seems to be a bit of confusion over what I meant here....The whole thing about me talking about people being prejudice is from a non-LBT fan's POV. I.e Someone who has no knowledge or very little knowledge of LBT and just coz they see a new sequel come up, they immediately say "It's crap coz it's another one!" My statement(s) were not aimed at anyone here or any other LBT fans. Their criticisms I accept becoz they actually know more about it and the LBT world then just looking at the front cover or just hearing about any sequel is on the way and blasting it before it's even released. Hope that clears that little misunderstanding up! |
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| Littlefoot1616 | Mar 11 2005, 08:33:28 AM Post #19 |
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The Inquisitive Quadruped (admin)
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No harm done Malte! It's all "cushdey" all everyone in my uni area says... Cant stand that flipping word! :angry: |
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| Petrie | Mar 11 2005, 04:52:20 PM Post #20 |
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I was aware from the beginning what you meant Jason. Same as you Malte, so I'm not mad at anyone of course. There are those out there that do say that they've gone too far and are just flogging a dead horse. There are some sequels that I would agree with that, but the difference is I actually watched the film and made that judgment.
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), plus a little side moral about Cera trying to cope with change when Tria comes into the picture, like a child trying to deal with a stepparent.
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9:25 AM Jul 11